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Comment by lnsru | Hacker News Reader

Well when a refugee with 2 kids gets 1890€ in cash, Kindergeld on top, free health insurance and free housing… I am also becoming very quickly populist and even neo-nazi follower. That’s income level of white collar worker after university studies and few years work experience. This nonsense with uncontrolled immigration must be over asap. Get the people some warm shelter and warm food, don’t throw money at them!

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What is ridiculous is that a "refugee" who burns his papers gets all that help. Then at the same time I had students who had to leave Germany because they did not find a job in time after their masters. These students have worked throughout their stay here and even payed into the system but were deemed either too foreign or too rich to get any financial assistance while searching for a job.

Germany is a weird place where if you play by the rules you get a very harsh treatment but if you cheat the rules you can get a lot of free shit.

"Look, you're just FORCING me to become a 'neo-nazi follower' by helping these people too much!"

A more apt description would be, taking money from Insrus pocket and giving it to someone else. Someone who deliberately broke the rules and exploited a system designed to help people in need.

I'd be pissed too if that were to happen to me.

While playing around with the N-word is certainly distasteful, the underlying question is pretty crucial.

Once upon a time, when Western economies were relatively stronger (compared to the rest of the world) and Western nations much younger, idealistic people constructed asylum systems that were rather generous to asylants and awarded them the same welfare payments as to the locals.

Year by year, the "global parameters" have shifted bit by bit, and these idealistic systems are now unsustainable. Germany cannot afford to be Sozialamt for millions of young men that manage to get there. It has too many unmet obligations towards its citizens, and most people tend to agree that citizens should come first.

Refusal to even look at this situation and reflexive blaming of all problems on "far right disinformation etc" will only make the necessary correction in the future much more painful and complicated.

Some countries, like Denmark, already understood the situation and adjusted their systems so that they don't attract people looking for better living standards under the guise of asylum.

It’s a very poor tasteful way of saying anti-immigrant sentiment doesn’t appear in a vacuum. That some auto label such people with this sentiment as neo Nazis is another issue.

This is what happens when the established parties refuse to do anything about it and don't even address the issue seriously, instead immediately labeling people who see the problem as "Nazis." The obvious conclusion from this is that these people are inevitably supporting parties that see this is an issue.

> I am also becoming very quickly populist and even neo-nazi follower

Yikes. Go read a history book before you end up like your predecessors from the 30s and 40s.

Your numbers looks very wrong. Any source for your claim?

My numbers are very right. Straight from the table of the lady who processes this particular case in local Finanzamt.

So you don't have any source, just some anecdotal claim, which contradicts public data. And since when is the Finanzamt responsible for refugees? That's the job of the Sozialamt. Are you maybe talking about a guestworker, not a refugee? Because refugees are unable to receive Kindergeld, unlike workers of jobs with social insurance.

Please start reading about the benefits for Ukrainian refugees. Then comment. Thank you.

Ukrainians are a special case. They are not handled as refugees, but EU-citizen, meaning they enter the normal social system. And this is beneficial for Germany, as Ukrainians are also able to enter the job market because of this. But even then your claims are sketchy. Even with Bürgergeld 1 adult + 2 kids needs to be an extreme case for such an amount.

I don’t know about if this is beneficial. I was born in Soviet Union as most of the Ukrainians and I have rudimentary russian language skills. I just don’t hear from refugees about great joy being in Germany and working here. Rather about stupid Germans giving money for free. When I brought trailer full of kitchen parts and Kleinkram to the shelter the so called refugees were standing and looking while German female helpers were offloading the stuff. I was invited into bbq with friendly Ukrainians who work very hard on poverty limit and live in Germany since 2014 and they invited their extended family who were “refugees”. It was 3 hours full of complaints about Germany, bad hotel, not cool place (somewhere Bad Tölz where people pay sick money to make hiking vacation).

Elephant is in the room, Germany has uncontrolled immigration problem. There is no need to see me as a nazi reinstalling gas chambers. But these all people are refugees, let’s give them warm shelter, warm food and 10€ a day for personal expenses. Ok, maybe 15€ per day. But don’t treat them better than other people living and working in Germany for many years.

> And this is beneficial for Germany, as Ukrainians are also able to enter the job market because of this.

If this were beneficial for Germany and the EU, Ukrainians would have had the right to enter the EU and get a job before the war.

In reality, it’s just an attempt to mitigate another immigration disaster.

It will fail, because there is no immigration solution for plummeting birth rates. The people coming to the EU (not specifically Ukrainians, which are perhaps better than average) are already adults, often with incompatible or lacking education, often with a different, incompatible upbringing, consuming significant state resources without having contributed a cent. This can’t work in combination with a social state, it’s just maths.

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