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Comment by corobo | Hacker News Reader

> But a single man adopting is considered as pervert

Is this evidence or assumption? Not challenging too hard just wondering if you've actually been called or treated like a perv or if it's something you assume will occur

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It is theoretically possible as a single male, but there are many more restrictions - in practice its very very rare. For example, see these requirements for a very large international adoption agency: [1]. In my experience there is, as OP describes, a strong stigma against single males, not just that they are considered perverts, but also that they are considered incapable of taking on this responsibility alone, not nurturing enough, too career-focused, etc.

[1] https://www.holtinternational.org/adoption/ See "Quick overview of parental eligibility requirements" section

Have you considered doing volunteer work with children. Something like Big Brothers?

I don't have the problem OP has, I just know something about the system. A better way to phrase this for a useful discussion (rather than unsolicited, assumed advice) would be to say "do you know if volunteer work with children would help alter this perception?".

Not sure by bt4u's comment is dead, but I've had that exact situation happen to me. Been accused of trying to steal a child while taking my son to the playground. It is an actual thing and it sucks.

I was at an amusement park recently. Took my daughter to go to the bathroom. I used a family stall. Someone knocked on the door and I said, "Occupied, we won't be much longer!" I heard a hushed whisper. A minute later, we're finishing up, washing our hands. A more aggressive knock, a man's voice, "Security. Open the door!"

This older woman with her 10-ish year old daughter had assumed that I, as a man, had no business being in a family stall. She went to get security to sort me out. Security asked me why I was using the family stall. I opened the door all of the way and pointed at my daughter (we have twin girls who are 4) who was drying her hands. The mom is aghast, "Where's her mother?" I scooped up my daughter and said, "I helped make her, too. Mom's busy. Mind your own business." and went back to my wife.

This is the most egregious example that I have but it's not at all an isolated event. Something in this direction has happened to me well over a dozen times in the last 4 years.

Another strong signal you can find: Many, maybe most, men's restrooms don't have a changing table. I've changed countless diapers while sitting on a toilet with one of my kids in my lap.

Is this an American thing? I can't imagine that happening in Europe, but maybe I'm just a bit naive.

Yes, this is completely an American thing. I experienced it first hand and it's hilarious. Hilarious in that it's so pathetically predicable that I can predict there's going to be a "situation" before it unfolds and am able to avoid it. But it's absolutely batshit crazy how easily it happens.

No way this happens in europe. Helicopter americans probably claim there is more child trafficking and kidnapping in europe or something. Yeah, ok. These people watch so many child kidnapping movies and documentaries they don't know which way is up anymore.

Yes, in California at the time. Some people get weird. It isn't like it happens all the time, it was a first for me.

It might be. I would get strange looks when I took my kids to the playground without my wife. They look like me, too.

Yeah we're kinda over the traditional family thing here in Europe. I would bet two fathers taking their son to the playground would raise some eyebrows in the US too, depending on the area of course. Whereas here it wouldn't.

I think it depends on where you are in Europe. I had far more reaction doing childcare in Poland than I did in the US and Canada. Almost completely positive, though. "Your wife is so lucky, a Polish man would never change a diaper".

Did you ever feel people were moments away from calling security/police on you? Your last sentence doesn't give that feeling. If not, I'm not sure we're talking about comparable reactions.

Oh ok, that surprises me, Poland has a reputation of being very strongly anti-LGBT (and Hungary too). Guess it depends on the area.

When I was in Ireland there were many people against single parents "Lone parents" they call them there, it was a real witch hunt in the media.

So yeah we get these things here but it tends to be localised.

It definitely will raise eyebrows, but maybe noone will say a thing. It really depends on the location though.

Whenever I see a comment like that I always wonder how it's possible that someone might actually challenge what we all know well and experienced multiple times throughout our adult lives.

Trolling or genuine question from a person that never witnessed what everyone else did?

I'm not a parent, I live in a small town in the UK, I've literally never seen this happen.

I've never even heard of it happening outside of Reddit. I figured maybe it might just be redditors coming off as creepy in general, but seeing the sentiment here too I figured I'd ask.

A solo dad out with their kid would probably go home with a pocket full of phone numbers here haha

Different people have different information mate. If I start trolling on HN I promise I'll make the comments more interesting than a pretty mild question :)

Thanks for your reply and insight. I'm in my 40s and having lived in 4 countries on 3 continents this theme is pretty consistent across cultures.

Ask your friends and family if they'd feel as confident employing a male child minder as a female one. Then ponder on the answers.

In child custody cases the man stands no chance unless the mother is an addict and a criminal. Or at least that's the case everywhere I've been.

It will absolutely occur. Men who take their kids to the playground by themselves are often confronted (by moms of other kids). At some point things are so obvious that not many people are going to bother finding a peer reviewed study to cite. Maybe they should but they won't.

Everyone's experience is different, but my understanding (and experience) has always been the opposite: People see a dad taking his kid out to the playground and think "dad of the year" before they think of a pervert, because the bar for what it takes to be a good dad is so low. There are so many uninvolved dads out there that the smallest token gesture like taking your kids to the playground is seen as some huge accomplishment.

But it's also insulting when someone makes off-hand remarks about "giving mom a break," etc. I have 4 year old twins and a nearly 2 year old singleton. We're all busy as fuck here, but no one ever diminishes my wife's ability to be a parent.

It only takes 1 bad Karen to spoil the experience of many dads who love taking their kids to the playground.

I've never seen that happen myself, but I have heard of it. My only theory is that it happens in places which are heavily socially/politically conservative and "backwards", where women can't imagine men being an actual real parent.

I live in a flyover state and have never had that sort of thing happen...I actually assumed the opposite, that socially/politically liberal areas would be less accustomed to seeing two-parent households and would be wealthy enough to have busybodies with too much time on their hands.

Gender equality is correlated with social liberalism, so that makes it more logical of a theory than that.

in new zealand men are not able to work as teachers or caregivers. which essentially means, men are not trusted with children. i don't think of new zealand as conservative or backwards, even though that attitude certainly is backwards, but that makes it tautological.

Not sure where you are but here in the UK I have been taking my children to the playground on my own for 10 years now and I have never seen this happen either to myself or another Dad. At the weekends I'd say it's mostly Dads in fact.

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