Hacker News Reader

Comment by MarkMarine | Hacker News Reader

This isn’t a closed system. It’s not perpetual motion, there is an EXTRAORDINARY amount of energy added to the system by the sun.

Saying “maths” instead of just math sounds quite odd, why are you making it plural? Is solving one equation “a math” and solving multiple equations “maths”?

View on HN

“Maths” is the contracted form (https://www.imperial.ac.uk/brand-style-guide/writing/grammar...) of MATHematicS. It had been in use in English-speaking countries since more than a century ago. As a matter of fact, it was also used in the US during the 19th century. Yet, for some curious reason, the Americans had stopped using contractions from some time onwards. So, “maths” became “math” and “PhD” became “Ph.D.”.

I think the justification is that because maths isn't plural in practice (I've never heard anyone say "mathematics are"), it's pointless to retain the s, and only leads to an awkward megasyllable like the end of "wasps."

The Anglo-American linguistic divide is always fun to examine. We don't always come out ahead, but now and then we get winner like "acclimate."

I think "mathematics are" is a normal construction. "We have a new widget that does this, but the mathematics of mass production are troubling."

If you don't like something coming between "mathematics" and "are", how about "I can prove Fermat's Last Theorem, but the mathematics are pretty high level." One could argue that many people would say "the math is pretty high level", but I think I've heard each before. It doesn't feel odd to write at all.

The thing that weirds me out about "mathematics are" is that it implies the possibility of there being a singular "mathematic".

That's fair. "scissors" is another weirdly plural word. It implies that there is a noun "scissor", but there isn't. (Verb, yes.)

I guess it would be one of the two blades. Likewise, a pant would be one of the two legs of a pair of pants.

Maybe a single mathematic would be a single concept/subject, like arithmetic or algebra?

That's fair. I was only thinking of it in the context of how mathematics is/are referred to as a subject, not as an actual concept. But what you say is true.

I've never heard anyone say "mathematics are"

The four mathematics are arithmetic, geometry, music, and astronomy.

Nah you would say "The four fields of mathematics are ..."

“Math” is used in USA and Canada. “Maths” is used by the rest of the English speaking world.

Yet another example of how the American education system is falling behind the rest of the world. Students in the US only learn one kind of math, but apparently the rest of the English speaking world is taught multiple kinds of maths.

I disagree to disagree, I henceforth declare this a mathses space for all mathstronauts

It derives from the latin: it's math if there's only one subject area being discussed, otherwise it's mathi.

Sounds ridiculous

No one has mentioned it but maths is short for mathematics. Also, your judgment of a very common figure of speech comes off as provincial.

Fair, I was being trite. The idea that the ocean is a closed system that doesn’t include all the solar energy, currents, mixing and everything else added to it plus an osmotic membrane would represent a perpetual motion machine just sounded so laughably stupid I was just trying to be equally annoying and dumb.

"Math" sounds funny as a brit - it's just what you're used to, although I will admit "math" is probably more technically correct.

Reminds me of "school of rock"

> So, get off your ath, let's do some math.

You do

"The rest" being Australia, New Zeeland, UK and Ireland?

Still a minority in people right?

+1.6 billion indians

Not native speakers. So if you count them, you need to count everyone else with English as secondary language. Then things become very messy.

Well, I guess a billion flies can be wrong.

Where's the part of the system where the energy from the sun comes into play?

The sun isn't what causes pressure in the ocean...

Not an expert, but from what I understand looking at the paper, the sun is what drives ocean mixing. Without ocean mixing, this method would eventually fully extract all the water out of the ocean water resulting in fresh water oceans on top of a floor of precipitated salt. Once that happened, the osmotic pressure would be exhausted and the system would stop working.

Lol. Oh sun isn’t what causes pressure? Shit I better go back to my thermo teacher and let him know.

Their claim does not involve energy any input from the sun.

> maths

That's what it's called in the UK (and maybe Australia & NZ). Shortening of mathematics. I could say the same about "legos". :)

Maths is common in UK

Reply on news.ycombinator.com