Hacker News Reader

Comment by echelon | Hacker News Reader

US oil and energy independence is reshaping the world dramatically.

The Saudis are no longer allies and are quickly becoming friends with the Iranians and the Chinese to shore up supply and demand.

The US only cares about middle east oil prices insofar as it goes to secure cheap energy for its allies. Now it looks to South America as its new partner. Manufacturing is moving to Latin America too. Mexico, in particular, is growing by leaps and bounds. Neighboring Texas is going to become a powerhouse of value added manufacturing.

It's a huge geopolitical shift that would have been unthinkable twenty years ago.

View on HN

The Saudis are no longer allies

Since when?

a better question might be -> when were they allies? It's been a while. For decades they've been nothing more than business partners that actively and openly conspire against us.

Trump helped out the saudis at least a few very important times, and we let them buy patriot missile systems regularly. We literally went to war with one of their rivals after the saudi royal family funded the people that attacked the World Trade Center.

They also like to do funny business with oil prices around election time when there is a Democrat in the oval office.

There is still a lot of love for the saudis, at least in the republican party.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq%E2%80%93Saudi_Arabia_rela....

>The Saudi leadership opposed the U.S. plan to invade Iraq in 2003 and did not join the Coalition. Their fears and warnings that Iraq would fracture along sectarian and political lines proved accurate.

>What was worse for Saudi Arabia was the strengthening of the Shi'ites in Iraq, seen as Iran's proxy. This drew the Iranian threat much larger for the Kingdom. Iraq, as a result of being now ruled by Shi'ites, have chosen Iran over Saudi Arabia as their closer ally.

Actually we didn't. The Saudis ewanted more us involvement vs iran during drone strikes on oil facilities origniating from either iraq or iran and yemen.

Since at least world war 2

Saudi buys a lot of US weaponry and sells like 70% of their oil to Asia. If anything they conspire with the United States against India/China to keep oil prices high in exchange for supporting US military industrial complex - or something along that line

Had been more than 1-2 years now. Surely related to the time Biden called their guy a murderer, but with much bigger developments afterwards...

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/biden-heads-saudi-....

Define ally.

Hell, Define Saudi Arabia...

Thank you mr Zeihan

The best thing that could happen to the ME and the US is disentanglement. We're not helping anything over there, and they would very much like us to fuck off.

Israel has nukes, we can still protect them without invading random Arab countries every 10 years.

Well, it might be better for the US, but I'm not sure that having China as a replacement trade partner is going to be any better for the people in middle east. Just looking at the places where they have gotten involved in Africa, it might seem like a good deal at first, but there are definitely strings.

But, regardless, it definitely is a much more hands off approach. Its kind of like Arrakis in Dune, as long as the spice (oil) flows, nobody cares about the inhabitants.

China and other Asian countries now imports a bulk of Saudi oil. US relies mostly on its own shale oil along with Canadian oil. Soon Mexico will have its own shale oil production. US does import oil from elsewhere but some of it is because US has a lot of refinery capacity to refine crude for others.

https://oec.world/en/profile/country/sau

Why does the US need to protect Israel? What’s in it for us? Honest question.

Ports, air strips, staging, logistics…

They’re our only friendly in a sea of declared enemies.

I’m sure we use those resources to defend Israel more effectively but I’m talking about using them for our own benefit.

Maybe with the US being energy independent we can let the Middle East move into the obscurity it so desperately needs. Once the stakes are more localized, they can work out their local issues without nations from halfway around the world getting PTSD trying to interfere.

Bahrain, Quatar, Kuwait, UAE, Jordan and Oman are all home to US military bases. If they are not allies, is the US an occupying power in these countries?

Depending on who you ask, yes

Fat lot of good it's doing in regards to genocidal Russia.

Yeah Israel does not have the US's back at all. At least Netanyahu does not. AIUI he and Biden are on very tense terms.

I dunno, it might half way be protecting the Middle East from Israel as much as the other way around.

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/friends-...

Sort answer, they're a staunch ally providing security, intelligence and economic partnerships.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com