Hacker News Reader

Comment by jimmygrapes | Hacker News Reader

Amen. An addendum, if I may: when considering "toxic" please be wary of all-or-nothing cognitive fallacies. People who have one trait or belief or habit that you disagree with (even if strongly) do not necessarily come saddled with other things you might presume (ie just because they're catholic doesn't mean they're a pedo, just because they have tattoos doesn't mean they're a criminal, just because they have guns doesn't make them a white supremacist, etc.). People are complex, and you might be missing your best friend for life if you are prejudicial.

View on HN

Also, a friend who is not your cheerleader for every dumb thing you do and bad trait you have, is not necessarily toxic.

You could be toxic, and they could just be pointing out things you need to hear.

People here the BS gurus to "clear the toxic people from their lives" and often estrange themselves from the people who actually care most for them...

I think this cognitive fallacy is actually called "labeling". Instead of labeling yourself: "I'm dumb", think "It was dumb when I forgot to turn off my car lights and the battery died".

You are not dumb, lazy, toxic, etc, but occasionally you do or say dumb, lazy, toxic things

I think there are some things that are a bright red line though. I don't think it's prejudicial a black person to avoid people who have a "habit" of going to KKK rallies. Or an immigrant to avoid people who have "one belief" that we should forcibly deport immigrants.

I think for certain habits, beliefs, etc. people who avoid you aren't simply "unwilling to overlook this one bad thing". Maybe that one bad thing is actually just bad enough to poison you the person. [hypothetical you]

I totally agree for the other, more general case though. Not all catholics are pedos and I know plenty of catholics super frustrated with their leadership, excellent and loving people catholicism included.

That's the problem with the weak popular vocabulary. 'Toxic' can mean just about anything.

well what matters is, what it means to you.

if a person makes you uncomfortable then it's probably better to stay away from them. only if you can't do that, then it may be worth it to reevaluate why it is they make you uncomfortable and see if you can change that.

> well what matters is, what it means to you

When giving advice on a public forum, it is very important to have similar understanding of words as others.

sure, but this is not about the definition of toxic, which is pretty clear and i don't think there is any disagreement about that. the point is that different things are toxic to different people. someone may not be bothered by guns, even when they don't care about them, and someone else may find any support of guns utterly despicable because maybe any mention of them triggers some kind of trauma they experienced. ok, so maybe it's not right to call this toxic, but that's why i used the term "uncomfortable' myself, and i don't think the specific difference is important. just possibly it could be argued that 'toxic' is to narrow. you want to avoid these people either way.

> this is not about the definition of toxic, which is pretty clear and i don't think there is any disagreement about that

Ok, then, can you explain to me what exactly it means?

Because the rest of your comment kinda boils down to "it means whatever you want it to mean" which renders it effectively meaningless.

the rest of your comment kinda boils down to "it means whatever you want it to mean"

no, it doesn't. i am not talking about the definition of "toxic". i am talking about what is toxic to you or to me. if something is toxic to me, then that doesn't mean it has to be toxic for you. i admit, my original statement was confusing. i didn't mean to say that it matters how toxic is defined, but: "what matters is, what is toxic or hurtful to you"

the definition of toxic (or my definition, if you prefer) is that toxic is anything that continuously hurts a relationship.

again, what is hurtful to me is not the same thing as what may be hurtful to you. we all have different vulnerabilities, and are bothered or hurt by different things.

The definition of toxic matters, because finding completely normal behaviors as hurtful might be indicative of a disorder in need of treatment.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com