Ask HN: Why would Google sell Google domains to Squarespace? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: Why would Google sell Google domains to Squarespace?

112 pointsalsodumb72 comments

I’ve been thinking about this all day and it just doesn’t make sense to me. I was hoping someone here would have a well-informed opinion/answer.

Google domains seemed like a natural tool in the GCP and Google ecosystem. It provided one-click access to setup website, Google workspace, provided direct verification in Google Search Console and Google Analytics, and just made sense.

Unlike some of the other investments like Stadia, domains is also not capital or resource intensive. They never offered discount on domains, they sold them at standard prices. The team working on domains must be small. It’s also a low risk project. Why would they kill it?

What next? They’ll sell Google Fi to T-mobile and abandon Google voice?

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My guess is customer support.

Domain registrars end up with a long tail of customers holding small numbers of domains. If Google sells a .com for $12, most of that goes to Verisign, and they're stuck with a customer who will get agitated when "their domain doesn't work." Many registrars use domains as a way to upsell hosting or premium domains (e.g. GoDaddy, Namecheap, Gandi) but the median Google Domains user is unlikely to be attracted to GCP.

Google dislikes having to deal with customers at scale (free users are fine as you can ignore them) and domain registration is high on the list of businesses where you end up with large amounts of customers expecting a certain level of service coupled and almost no margin to provide it.

>My guess is customer support.

I'm inclined to agree. A one-off $12 purchase with a thin margin doesn't pay for much at the Google side. Squarespace are pretty good at support, and they have a lot of upsell potential with their core stuff.

Consider also that Google Workspace with its (presumably?) fatter monthly / annual margins also comes with pretty basic and sometimes semi-opaque support…and that's with Google controlling most or all the moving parts, with no tithe paid to the upstream domain folks.

Google Domains might have been a shortlist for tech-savvy people, but in my experience the Squarespace (and Shopify, and Wix etc) SaaS site builder crowd largely want stuff in the same place as their hosting. Pay one place for domain, DNS, platform, etc. Done.

(PS: I am not /user?id=petercooper replying to himself…)

> Google Domains might have been a shortlist for tech-savvy people

In the 2000s, yes, but Google has worked hard to shed that reputation - starting with Reader and especially after mismanaging Google Apps for Domains. Even the total Android fanboys I know tend to recommend not using Google services, which is impressive for how much goodwill they torched.

I think a large part of it is that even their fans never thought they were ever good for support. As you mentioned, a really nice reason to let Squarespace et al. is that you have one place responsible for everything without finger-pointing.

For Android I use Huawei with HarmonyOS. It is very nice hardware at 50% discount, comes degoogled and with software updates. Installing FDroid, Brave, VLC, Telegram and Termux is simple (I do not use anything else).

Yeah, change your master, the next one may probably treat you better and give you some meat on Sundays.

I wouldn't trust Huawei any more than I trust Alphabet.

(PS: I am not /user?id=petercooper replying to himself…)

Haha, I was about to say! I did a double take myself when I got the HN Replies email.

Wait you guys get reply notifications?

It's third party but been around for many years: https://hnreplies.com/

This actually makes sense, as ICANN requires registrars to provide a decent-enough support for registrants (https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/registrar-accred...).

I think your guess would be right, if it wasn't for the fact that Google has perfected the art of providing absolutely no customer support. They are experts at hiding behind walls and setting up moats. So I don't think support was a factor in this specific case.

I’m not sure that’s disagreement: people expect support for this so Google knows that they either have to staff up or get out of the business, and they picked that option.

AWS provides a registrar too right?

How do they handle this support issue?

Could google keep the domain registrar for GCP instead of dropping it all?

They do. But AWS does provide support and tends to be reasonable at it. Route 53 is dug deep enough into AWS that it doesn't really attract casual users who tend to be disproportionately more expensive to service.

I'm sure GCP could do a similar thing by spinning up a registrar solely for GCP users.

Yes that was my expectations too but then I read that they are also ditching the GCP interface to the registrar

Doesn’t Google just ignore paid users too?

This is probably correct but really scary because it does apply to Google Fi and Google Voice as well.

Fi support is garbage. I've had so many issues. I'm busy and tired all the time or I'd have left. I hope the day comes where they shutter the thing adti finally have a forcing function.

Wouldn't the logical upsell be Google Workspace...?

I think the issue there is that Workplace is already the bigger, well established product that people are already aware of and using.

Registars upsell to higher margin products and services that they aren't well known for (e.g. GoDaddy has dedicated server plans). Google probably has anyone who would use Workspace in the door already via Gmail.

This is illustrated in The Innovator's Dilemma and happens all the time. Established companies want to focus resources, increase profit margin, and improve operational efficiency. They improve their best product and sell to big customers. Not-so-successful product with not so wealthy clients got de-prioritized. They don't mind letting competitors take the market share. Why would they? It is lower margin business with low quality customers anyway. They may even sell the money losing product to competitor to milk out the last pennies.

The section "Q: Won't Big Company X just clone your product and steal all your customers?" in https://apenwarr.ca/log/20180724 also described this phenomenon

Good catch! If someone is interested, look into IBM, and how they create and shed divisions over decades.

I am interested. Do you have any material to share where I could "look at IBM"? Thanks.

> The team working on domains must be small

I wonder if this is true. Technology-wise, maybe, but I wonder if domains just requires a lot of negotiation and contact with registrars. I suspect it might be quite labour intensive in that way.

Additionally, to sell to consumers you need to provide services like helping people port domains for renewal, helping with DNS setup, and other consumer-level customer support, and that's expensive. If you've ever heard a Hover advert on a podcast, it sounds like an expensive business to run.

That sort of business doesn't fit with the cloud business. For cloud, sure customers will want a domain, but any business using cloud will have the ability to buy a domain, it's unlikely to be a deal breaker for using GCP, and the only up-side is $10-$100 a year on the account, that's less than a single VM for a month in many cases.

Disclaimer: I work at Google but haven't looked into this at all, this is all personal speculation as an outsider and previous customer of GCP.

Having worked at a domain registrar over 10 years ago, it was a whole lot of paperwork, compliance and very little profit in it. That's why everyone is trying to sell you addon services when you buy a domain. Customer support is also an issue, there's always this one case where someone lost control over their domain that consumes a whole lot of time.

Absolutely this. Paperwork, legal obligations, and user support woes, with minuscule margins.

It's a shame, as they tied in domain ownership verification and basically one-click Workspace setup if your desired Workspace domain was already with GD...

Google Domains != GCP Cloud Domains

One is managed at domains.google.com, the other as part of a GCP project either in the Console or via API. See https://cloud.google.com/domains/docs/register-domain

They’re selling the former.

I was going to say - it would be extremely stupid to not offer domain registration as a part of your cloud platform - the way billing works at most companies - not having this would often be a deal breaker for using a cloud provider.

Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. While I wouldn’t have shifted my domains to google, because of exactly what has just transpired, I am considering moving everything to cloudflare for the same reason I should have moved them to google.

My domains are the starting point for my other infra/sites/web apps. And cloudflare has become that product that already sits there, dns, cdn and workers.

If google can’t sort that out, they seem dysfunctional. Cloudflare seems to understand the value and execute accordingly.

And their positioning as “at cost domains” makes it a no brainer. Only a matter of time before I move them all over.

the only thing keeping me from Cloudflare is the clunky email forwarding; there's also namecheap and porkbun

Because Google is an Ad Company.

Everything else is a hobby. Holding this removes from the focus of bringing up ad revenue. We will see them get rid of a lot of these things.

The point is that they were also installing tracking scripts on the website, which gives them data, which is their oil that they refine into profitable ad placement.

No they don't. What are you talking about?

> It provided one-click access to setup website, Google workspace, provided direct verification in Google Search Console and Google Analytics, and just made sense.

If you're not familiar with it, Google Analytics is a bunch of tracking scripts.

> provided direct verification in Google Search Console and Google Analytics

Yes, it allows you to easily verify you own your domain: in both Search Console and Analytics. Doesn't mean they'd automatically add analytics to your site.

How would they do that? If you point the DNS record to your server, the visitors call your server, not Google's. They can't just MiTM it.

Seems you're right, sorry, I misunderstood.

> and abandon Google voice?

Speaking as a long time user of Google Voice I'd say that they all but abandon it quite some time ago. Voice still mostly works but it's barely limping along. I'm slowly, one by one, getting my contacts to switch to my carrier number because I don't hold out much hope for Voice being usable product for much longer.

You can port your number out of voice, which is nice. I happened to get a number that spells something fun, so I would keep it that way.

They are actively promoting their Google Voice product via their Google Workspace organisation/enterprise product suite, I've had multiple sales emails over the past couple of months trying to promote it. Perhaps they are winding down their consumer product, but the enterprise product seems to be still alive.

You know you can port your google voice number away, right? I’ve ported mine in both directions.

Oh god dont even get me started on this! This has really put me in a bad spot because now I have to move all my doamins onto a new host not to mention all the emails I have to update. Seriously fuck Google.

“In keeping with our efforts to sharpen our focus, we have entered into a definitive agreement with Squarespace for the acquisition of customer accounts of the Google Domains registrar business,” said Matt Madrigal, Vice President and General Manager, Merchant Shopping of Google.

I imagine they've underestimated what it takes to operate as a domain registrar, and presumably there's too much politics and conflict of interest in that space.

My guess is because it just doesn't bring in enough profits. Most domain registrars make money through volume by either having a relatively small team (porkbun etc.), having most of the team located in a low CoL jurisdiction (Namecheap and eastern Europe/formerly Ukraine), or from value added services/the registrar acting as a loss leader (pretty much every service do this to an extent, CloudFlare, GoDaddy etc.)

For a company like Google that pays top tier salary, there is no way that selling domains (especially not in bulk, their targets are mostly consumers and businesses, domain traders use other services) make enough money. If you take a look at the commiters on https://github.com/google/nomulus

That's at least 10 engineers maintaining one component. Add in SRE and product executives, you are looking at expenses in the two digit millions minimum.

The decision is definitely short sighted but somebody high up no longer wants it as a loss leader.

Because, as a registrar, they are not allowed to just shut it down.

More seriously, Google's culture seems fundamentally incapable of longterm investment in anything that isn't directly related to their core advertising business, even if that thing is an onramp to their core offerings (as you pointed out). It's sad and frustrating to observe.

Google offers domain registration through Google Cloud and its feature set competes directly with Route 53:

https://cloud.google.com/dns (Cloud Domains)

Google Domains competes with hosting registrars like GoDaddy.

FWIW I was able to move a bunch of my Google Domains domains over to Google Cloud Domains, but not without a couple hitches:

- The default quota is 20 domains per account, so I have to wait to get an increase approved. Surprisingly, they have a happy-path for transferring a domain you already own in Google Domains, but it counts against the same quota as a new registration.

- Some domains supported by Google Domains are not supported by Google Cloud. It seems to be about “premium” pricing, not the TLD.

Hopefully they improve the experience in the transition period: increase the quota and reach parity in domains supported.

I was hoping to move over to Google Cloud Domains, too. Looks like Google Cloud Domains "is to be fully deprecated as part of this sale".

https://twitter.com/GergelyOrosz/status/1669726481130434563

Also scratching my head...

The most logical thing that would make sense to me is that someone at SquareSpace has a close relationship with someone at Google that is able to influence such decisions?!

Probably a relationship play more than anything see here from March when Squarespace wrote about migrating their analytics lake house to Google Cloud: https://cloud.google.com/blog/products/data-analytics/square...

> They’ll sell Google Fi to T-mobile and abandon Google voice?

Why not?

As someone who shifted all their domains to Google Domains at the cost of margin.. I guess I'm shifting back to PorkBun or NameCheap.

I hold domains at nearly all the popular registrars (eggs, one basket, etc.) but https://iwantmyname.com/ is another I want to add to the list. It's not often mentioned but is notable in being one of very few registrars to not attempt upsells to hosting, services, etc. NameCheap irritates me with this practice in particular.

I love IWMN except for the fact that their 2FA implementation is deprecated and falls back to SMS (which is not a secure enough channel for something as important as domains). I’ve been emailing them about this annually for several years and they’ve no plans to improve it, so I’m going to move my domains away :(

Fair point! I also somehow failed to notice they were acquired by a larger company a few years ago which is often a bad sign long term in my experience. I guess I will maintain my policy of using about ten different registrars.. :-)

I'm curious why you shifted to them in the first place. What did they offer you that PorkBun of NameCheap did not?

I’m not the OP but I’ll note that google domains was the only way to use a personal domain with a consumer/free gmail account without that “sent on behalf of” thing, if I recall correctly. I moved away from Gmail a few years ago, so I’m a bit foggy on the details, but that was why I moved to google domains way back when.

Thanks for replying. So if I understand before this correctly before this event you could use a google domain with gmail without having to sign up to google workspaces?

Ah, not quite — sorry for my confusing reply! It’s just that you could “send mail as” your custom domain without “on behalf of” showing up for the recipient.

This was also why I chose gDomains, and I'm very sad that they're getting rid of that product now. I guess I'll have to look at my options again soon.

same -____- and im starting not to like namecheap. Someone else mentioned CloudFlare but for me only if their email forwarding is solid.

Email forwarding seems to work pretty well for me. Just moved to Cloudflare this morning and it only took a minute or two to configure everything. Although I was already using Cloudflare for DNS, so all I had to do was transfer the domain registration, then remove the old MX records from Google and click a button to add the Cloudflare ones.

Because it costs too much just to cancel it.

More like there are actual legal consequences to do so. Remember that they've only sold the registrar part, not the registry part (aka the one operating .dev and .zip among others). ICANN binds Google (and others) to maintain all validly-purchased domains, whether by a slow shutdown (no renewals, only obligation of current period) or by acquiring it by some other registrar: Squarespace (or more specifically its subsidiary) is already an accredited registrar (https://www.icann.org/en/accredited-registrars?page=1&iana-n...). The "carrot" is even stronger for Google because if ICANN sees them as naughty, ICANN can pull the registry part (which also holds their .goog and .google TLDs) and make Google's life miserable.

What? Google selling Domains to Squarespace?

For anyone that missed it, is there a link to the story you're talking about? on here or otherwise

And if there is a story on here (which obviously there would be) why aren't you just in there asking your question with everyone else? :-\

Alphabet selling Google Domains assets to Squarespace (427 pts, 188 comments)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36346454

Squarespace Enters Definitive Agreement to Acquire Google Domains Assets (260 pts, 251 comments)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36349033

Google Domains shutting down, assets sold to Squarespace (76 pts, 94 comments)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36346619

Does anyone know if this change is going to affect top-level domains operated by Google, for example .dev?

They looked at the numbers and forgot about being critical to developers as a brand point.

CloudFlare Domains is better, a core business of CloudFlare and google would have to invest to compete. Which on the revenue does not make sense.

I don’t think this is about competing with Cloudflare. Google Domains is good-enough and likely better for most of their users than Cloudflare, if only because they already have a Google account and know the brand.

Arguably Cloudflare Registrar is not a core business considering it makes no money.

Cloudflare’s core business is being the front end of your web presence. They provide DNS and CDN services, so bring a registrar is a natural fit because it provides the last thing you need to keep your web site online and secure. There’d be demand for a registrar just because that’s what prevents domain takeover attacks on the first part of that security chain.

its more like the hot dogs at Costco.

100% agree

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