Hacker News Reader

Comment by sebastos | Hacker News Reader

I personally find that some soft version of this idea rings very true. It feels like there's a big segment of the population that has inherited this assumption that they would hate living outside of the largest population centers.

Of course, everybody's living preferences are always being pushed around by this trend or that, so I'm not saying this situation is unprecedented. But this idea that most of the country is unlivable for progressives seems particularly widespread in its influence, and particularly ill-fitting for most people's actual preferences. I'd wager a lot of people are missing out on a lot of living options they'd actually love because they've unknowingly imported some pernicious memes.

View on HN

I tried the suburbs, no thanks, now I’m gonna try NYC. I want to walk to noodles at 1am.

  they've unknowingly imported some pernicious memes

https://www.usatoday.com/videos/news/politics/2023/06/11/naz...

What you call pernicious meme I call not wanting to live amongst neo-Nazis.

Out of the 23M people living in the 54K square miles of Florida you assume that 2 dozen idiots is the modal populace?

Bit more than two dozen I'd say.

https://www.npr.org/2023/03/10/1158344050/florida-far-right-...

https://www.local10.com/news/florida/2022/01/31/nazi-protest...

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/01/ron-desantis...

https://nypost.com/2023/05/08/florida-neo-nazi-who-became-mu...

https://hyperallergic.com/785647/alt-right-protesters-brandi...

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/2023/04/25/antisemit...

Interesting that all your links never describe more than a single person or at most “15-20”. I have lived in Florida for more than four decades with family roots here going back to the 1930s…I can count on one hand with fingers leftover the number times I have encountered a “nazi”.

But hey, feel free to stay away if you think you are gonna be surrounded by those assholes. You won’t be of course, because despite what the media and others might claim, Florida is pretty damned diverse and a quick visit to pretty much anywhere here would reveal that.

Interesting that you think 15–20 Nazis (or, you know, people flying the Nazi flag) is acceptable or that any Nazis killing folks is somehow acceptable. But, you know, fair point about going back to the 30s as Florida has historically been klan country.

Oh look, the Klan's still nice and active in Florida.

https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/kkk-allegedly-threat...

  Florida is pretty damned diverse

Fair. You've got the klan, neo-nazis, moms for liberty, white lives matter, goyim defense league, natsoc florida, and of course the patriot front. That's pretty diverse.

https://www.adl.org/resources/report/hate-sunshine-state-ext...

Even if you were anywhere near correct, Florida is still being run by one man culture war. That shit desantis is pulling? That's not media hyperbole, that's not memes, they're the law of the land. Why would I want to put down roots somewhere that leads the nation in book banning? Or that looked at a shortage of teachers and thought that lowering (well, eliminating) standards was more appropriate than improving conditions?

Why would I set down roots somewhere where the government is trying to legislate the opposition party out of existence?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2022/apr/...

Let's not forget SB1718. I guess that wasn't really meant to be actionable? Just intended to keep the darkies in line?

I've gotta figure that the NAACP and HRC are onto something with their travel advisories, but then again I never did buy the "big bad media" myth that you're trying to sell.

Florida is an environment that's openly hostile to people who aren't white, heterosexual, christian men. Don't complain when people who aren't in that demographic avoid or leave Florida.

Nowhere did I say it was acceptable. I refered to them as idiots and assholes.

Also nowhere did I complain that people were leaving the state for that reason.

What I said, since you seem hell bent on a straw man argument tactic, was that the population of Florida was large and diverse and the number of neo-nazi assholes are so few that in 45 years of living here I have encountered maybe 3.

But hey your opinion so formed from apparently zero practical experience and only the political commentary and news commentary that you read should certainly keep you away. The growing intentional increase of population in the state, including quite ironically to this conversation, several of my non-white, non-Christian, non-male, and in one case, non-heterosexual remote working coworkers who could live literally anywhere…have chosen to disagree with your assessment of the diversity and friendly nature of the state.

  The growing intentional increase of population in the state,
  including quite ironically to this conversation, several of
  my non-white, non-Christian, non-male, and in one case, non-
  heterosexual remote working coworkers who could live
  literally anywhere…have chosen to disagree with your
  assessment of the diversity and friendly nature of the state.

So if the gays aren't avoiding Florida like Peter I-wanna-suck-your-blood Thiel is claiming, what are you complaining about?

This started with a reference to a small group of Nazi flag waving protesters outside Disney World and an assumption that that group represents the population of Florida. After ironically confirming my comment about the small sizes of these neo-Nazis here in Florida with your own links trying to disprove my point (that was a really weird debate tactic BTW), you have now decided to expand this nazi group to all sorts of people you don’t agree with. Yes, if you move to Florida you might encounter someone who holds a different viewpoint than you. I suspect that to be the case everywhere though.

Florida is diverse and growing. I am sorry that bothers you, feel free to not move here if you feel you would be unhappy, we could certainly use one less car on the road.

  This started with a reference to a small group of Nazi flag waving protesters
  outside Disney World and an assumption that that group represents the population
  of Florida

And yet groups like the Anti Defamation League and the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People are showing a rise in hate groups. Go figure.

  confirming my comment about the small sizes of these neo-Nazis here in Florida

Time for you to get some perspective. What you consider to be a small group of Nazis and "people you don’t agree with" is far larger and more widespread than in for e.g. New York City. What you consider small is pretty damn large for anyone on the outside looking in.

  you have now decided to expand this nazi group to all sorts of people you
  don’t agree with

And there it is. That old chestnut. No. The klan is not simply a group that I "don't agree with." Gerrymandering voting districts to eliminate any black pluralities is not simply a disagreement it's an existential threat.

  Florida is diverse and growing.

I'm not quite sure why you're harping on diversity. These diverse people that you seem to love to trot out are being persecuted. They're also leaving because of the persecution that you seem to think doesn't exist.

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/2023/05/31/families-...

You really really like to straw man in a conversation, don’t you?

Stay focused on the original point. A small group of flag waving Nazis protested at Disney world and you were concerned about living amongst them. I conveyed my long experience that I have not encountered hardly any of those people in my decades of living here and that I found the state diverse with population that enjoys living here.

Your rant here simply does not change my lived experience.

Anybody who forms their opinion of any US state from papers like the Guardian UK instead of actually, you know, visiting the state in question usually results in people developing very stupid and ill-conceived impressions. It's as if there are a group of urbanites who form their impression of Florida entirely from Florida Man memes.

  Anybody who forms their opinion of any US state from papers like the
  Guardian UK instead of actually, you know, visiting the state in question
  usually results in people developing very stupid and ill-conceived impressions.
  It's as if there are a group of urbanites who form their impression of Florida
  entirely from Florida Man memes.

How's that saying go? When you assume you make an ass out of you? Yeah. I've been to Florida. As far north as Jacksonville and as far south as Key West. It's almost as if you're trying to ignore the litany of hate groups that are festering in Florida because it doesn't fit your narrative.

But, here, have a couple more sources on the vile gerrymandering. Even the courts have pointed out how racist the desantis redistricting was. But, sure, hang your hat on your fear of the Guardian.

https://www.propublica.org/article/ron-desantis-florida-redi...

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/redistricting-2022-maps...

> It's almost as if you're trying to ignore the litany of hate groups that are festering in Florida because it doesn't fit your narrative.

It’s almost as if you are trying to ignore the litany of non-hate and wonderfully diverse groups of people living without issue and being a significant portion of the people in Florida because it doesn’t fit your narrative.

Had to point out that keeping pornographic and sexually explicit material out of school libraries is entirely within the reasonable realm of authority of school boards and has nothing to do with freedom of speech, which the phrase "book banning" implies.

  Had to point out that keeping pornographic and sexually explicit material out
  of school libraries is entirely within the reasonable realm of authority of
  school boards and has nothing to do with freedom of speech, which the phrase
  "book banning" implies.

Had to point out that pornography isn't what's being banned. Unless you consider titles like "Anne Frank's Diary", "Beloved", "To Kill a Mockingbird", "Slaughterhouse-Five", "Stamped from the Beginning: the Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America", "Me and Earl and the Dying Girl", or "Race and Policing in Modern America" to be pornographic, in which case you've got some seriously unusual kinks.

Schools don't usually make a habit of putting pornography in their libraries, (much to my surprise) not even in Florida.

Perfect example. A state the size of a European country probably with more diversity and lifestyle than one too, but you imagine you will be persecuted?

So you're making excuses for Nazis now? As I've already posted, it's not like this was some isolated incident.

No, the persecution I'd be worried about comes at the hands of a governor more worried about waging a culture war than actually running the state. You may agree with the governor, and that's great for you. For the people being targeted, avoiding Florida is a matter of survival, it's not being hoodwinked by some silly meme.

I wouldn't be comfortable having a female partner knowing that the state is waging war on reproductive rights. I wouldn't be comfortable raising kids in Florida given that it's leading the nation in book bans. I'd worry about a state that's so desperate to find teachers that they will accept military service instead of actual vocational training.

As a human being I don't want to live in a state where the government is engaging in a high profile ideological fight against a gigantic corporation in an effort to silence non-heterosexuals. I hear South Florida is nice, except for the whole anti-Cuba thing.

Hell, if I lived in Florida I'd worry about using radioactive waste to pave roads.

No, thank you. I prefer living in a state governed by someone who at least pretends to act like an adult. It's not a matter of missing some hidden gem, it's a matter of looking at the reality and deciding that's simply not for you.

Me? I've spent enough time in Florida. The infestation of jesus and gun billboards, the weather, and the infrastructure were enough to put me off. The more recent ascension of the culture-warrior-in-chief is just icing on the cake.

https://wusfnews.wusf.usf.edu/education/2023-04-21/new-repor...

Reply on news.ycombinator.com