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Comment by intellectronica | Hacker News Reader

For reading, I'd recommend everything from Will Larson ( https://lethain.com ).

As for attitude and behaviours for making the jump, it's a combination of actively looking for opportunities (that's the easy part), and positioning yourself as someone who is an obvious choice for such a position, which is basically when you consistently have an attitude and reputation of total ownership, supporting others, never complaining or taking it easy and instead always thinking and delivering at a wider scope, being the person people come to for making a decision on what and how to do, rather than a person who is being told what and how to do.

Some people do all of that naturally. Lucky them. Others don't, and it's a journey to adjust. You don't need to be a "natural", but if you aren't you need to learn to behave like one before you can credibly go into a leadership position.

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> Some people do all of that naturally. Lucky them. Others don't, and it's a journey to adjust. You don't need to be a "natural", but if you aren't you need to learn to behave like one before you can credibly go into a leadership position.

Nicely put, but can be also considered as a warning.

If it doesn't come "naturally" to you, do you really want a leadership role? You will need to learn, fake and struggle to achieve something that others do without any effort. Are you ready for it? Do you want to do it? Is it worth it for you? And although faking can get you to the first line management role, the effort to go a step further would be exponentially harder if you are not a natural talent.

Or, to use a fake sport parallel, if you are not a natural talent, with a lot of effort you can make it to the high school team, with even more effort you may even become a starter, but you'll never be a lead player, or be able to play in a college team, and you'll enter a NBA stadium only if you pay a ticket.

EDIT: this applies to every job, not only management. If you are not a natural talent, there's a limit to what you can do, regardless of the effort.

> this applies to every job, not only management. If you are not a natural talent, there's a limit to what you can do, regardless of the effort.

I'd say that's not true for most jobs. For jobs which are an extension of a hobby such as sports and programming, there's truth in that. If you've been living and breathing the hobby since elementary school because it's what you love then yes, you have a big advantage over someone who starts doing it in the university as part of formal education.

But most jobs aren't like that.

For instance nobody is a natural at something as unnatural as cutting open someone's heart and stiching it back together succesfully. And nobody is doing that in elementary or high school. It's an unnatural skill you can learn only by applying yourself in medical school and if you work and study hard at it, become a heart surgeon.

I actually think it's absolutely fine to not be a natural and still want it, and that the comparison to a physical talent isn't perfect, because in something as complex as engineering management you can really get very good even if you don't have the natural aptitude, whereas if you are too short to play on the NBA, you won't play on the NBA no matter how hard you practice. You're right though that it's worth thinking if it's really what you want, or it just looks good on others. And then sometimes the only way to find out is by giving it a try.

> if you are too short to play on the NBA, you won't play on the NBA no matter how hard you practice

Tyrone Bogues played 14 years in the NBA despite being by all pundits way too short to play basketball at any level.

Got news for you. Being a good leader or manager doesn’t come natural to anyone out of the gate. Sure some people have certain advantageous traits, but they probably aren’t what you think they are. For instance, you might assume charisma and confidence are important, but they can backfire and leave your reputation in tatters if you don’t have a high level of foundational knowledge and experience-honed judgement. The actual ingredients to a leadership personality are more subtle and something a young person is often ill-equipped to judge in themselves. Don’t box people in.

I hate this sort of logic. Sounds far too much like social darwinism.

Sometimes things that are worth doing are hard.

> Sometimes things that are worth doing are hard.

I said that in my comment already, if for you, it's not worth doing it, don't do it. The unwritten assumption is that you should do it if it's worth it to you, even if it's hard.

> you'll never be a lead player, or be able to play in a college team, and you'll enter a NBA stadium only if you pay a ticket

Sounds like you're saying "If you aren't a prodigy from the start you're not going to amount to anything"

FAANG middle managers don't grow on trees. It's way easier to get into that space than the NBA IMO

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