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Comment by mustacheemperor | Hacker News Reader

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> some kind of false dichotomy here that "somebody" is either Russia or another violent regime

But it is true. Europe has increased gas imports from Algeria with the excuse that "Russia bad". Like Algeria is any better.

Algeria is absolutely better in essentially every way. In particular, they're not invading neighbours, murdering tens of thousands of civilians or attempting to erase a culture and a language from existence.

Wrong[0]. Algeria has an important role in the ongoing Western Sahara conflict, caused by its rivarly with Morocco. Also wait till you learn that Algeria has strong ties with Russia. Hint: they conduct joint military exercises and buy weapons from Russia.

> In particular, they're not invading neighbours, murdering tens of thousands of civilians or attempting to erase a culture and a language from existence.

Source for tens of thousands of dead civilians in Ukraine?

Btw following this logic what should we say about the USA with Iraq or Afghanistan? The count of dead civilians goes to the hundreds of thousands, and that's only counting those caused directly. If you add the civilians deaths caused indirectly by bombing two countries to ash then this starts to look like a genocide.

Because right now Europe is buying a lot more gas from the USA, all to the USA's profit of course. If the parameter of choice is "number of dead civilians caused by wars" then Europe should still buy Russian gas.

.0 https://ecfr.eu/publication/north-african-standoff-how-the-w...

> The NATO intervention in Yugoslavia is not remotely like an atrocity like the destruction of Grozny.

Why is that?

At least, Russia has rebuilt Grozny since then, whereas NATO just left Serbs to their own devices.

Neither do Russians care that much what people of the EU feel. We have our own mental resources to reflect on the shit we made, so the NATO countries are encouraged to reflect on their own shit and stop nagging us. And take your NGOs with you.

Meanwhile we still have a war to win, or at least to end.

I'm not sure if you genuinely think the extent of the destruction in Grozny is comparable to the extent of the destruction in Yugoslavia after the NATO intervention, but it wasn't, and neither was the need to rebuild. NATO did not grind any Yugoslav cities to dust, and killed hundreds, not thousands, of civilians. Furthermore, NATO did not invade and conquer Yugoslavia, which seems like a key point in regards to rebuilding. The Chechens did not get the opportunity to rebuild Grozny themselves because Russia destroyed their government, tricked their leadership into being slain while withdrawing, and re-created their state as Russian. The Chechens wanted to be left to their own devices to run their country. Russia invaded in response, and killed and destroyed until there was nothing left to defend.

Can you recognize the absolute distortion of perspective it takes to look at Russia invading Chechenya to prevent its independence, destroying its capital to force it to surrender, and then say "well at least Russia rebuilt it after they conquered it!"

>NATO countries are encouraged to reflect on their own shit and stop nagging us

Your country invaded a NATO-friendly nation on the border of NATO. You are not being "nagged" when that country's government calls the world for aid and the world, shocked and appalled at the actions of your bloodthirsty regime, responds.

Look, I won't even attempt to convince you any further - either your government will collapse and the harsh rays of sunlight will expose the truth for you, or your government will continue to close its doors to the outside world until what you believe won't matter at all anyway. I don't imagine I have the rhetorical ability to break through your distorted worldview myself.

You lost this war in 2021. At this point, it's just a question of how many Ukrainian and Russian lives you will waste before accepting it.

I sincerely hope that you find a way out of a violent and destructive mindset. The only one to blame for Russia's isolation and woes are Russians themselves.

The day that Russia stops sabotaging elections, bribing officials, and murdering innocents is the day that Russia will be accepted openly.

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