This particularly perturbed me with the implication that "ruining" a few people is fine as long as a few other people are made wealthier.
Greatest country etc.
Probably universities or departments as a whole should be sued.
We're in this mess because federal student loans live in a bizarro world where they're not subject to any of the normal market forces, checks, and balances that make regular debt work well for society. They are handed out without any kind of real due-diligence, and have absolutely no incentive to be good investments.
If we want to redistribute wealth to invest in education, that's fantastic, but we should just give it in the form of grants, scholarships, or (only in my dreams) some free regional federal universities and technical colleges. Instead we tried to play with the market and got burned, which isn't surprising to anyone with who has studied economics.
I don't want to counter your strawman with another, but not everyone needs to get an engineering degree.
This isn't true. If you go to a state school and work part time to cover your living expenses, you can get an undergrad degree very cheap. And the most prestigious of private schools (e.g. Ivy league) offer very generous needs-based scholarships, so if you come from a poor family you don't have to pay.
You "have to" get a huge loan if you choose to attend a very expensive private school that won't give you a needs-based scholarship. But nobody has to do that, it's a choice some people make. It's a decision made by naive kids straight out of highschool so I still have some sympathy, but this narrative of necessarily having to take huge loans is part of the problem and helps to normalize this. The belief that huge loans are necessary in America is wrong and contributes to the real problem.
From: https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeltnietzel/2021/11/01/whic...
> The 2021-22 average tuition and fees sticker price for full-time, in-state students at public four-year colleges ranged from a low of $6,100 in Wyoming to a high of $17,750 in Vermont.
> Following Wyoming, the least expensive states were Florida ($6,370), Montana ($7,265), Utah ($7,387), and North Carolina ($7,389).
> After Vermont, the most expensive states for four-year universities were New Hampshire ($17,040), Pennsylvania ($15,312), New Jersey ($14,963), and Illinois ($14,667).
> Over the past five years, average in-state tuition and fees at public four-year institutions fell in 18 states after adjusting for inflation. During that same time period, only six states (Alaska, Connecticut, Nevada, North Dakota, Oregon and Rhode Island) saw their average in-state tuition increase by 10% or more.
> According to the report, in 2019-20, 75% of first-time, full-time students attending public two-year colleges received federal, state or institutional grant aid. At public four-year universities, 78% of students were awarded such aid.
> The average net tuition and fees paid by first-time, full-time in-state students at public four-year institutions was estimated to be $2,640, the lowest it’s been since 2006-07, down more than a $1,000 from a peak in 2012-13 of $3,720 (in 2021 dollars).
Finding for state schools has dropped so low many private schools are cheaper than state schools. That doesn’t mean all schools are unaffordable without loans, living at home while going to school can make a huge difference.
But scool for some doesn’t mean there’s no problem.
> summer expenses
Cost of living expenses will be incurred whether you go to college or not. Regardless, most people go home for the summer and 'mooch' off their parents. Summer is also a good time to find an internship. With good internships you can pay off much of your debt before you even graduate. If good internships don't exist for whatever you're studying, that should be taken as a warning..
I actually applied for VT years ago and the only thing they offered was student loans making many private schools far more affordable. Further unless something changed they don’t let freshman figure out their own accommodation. So our hypothetical recent graduate has to actually spend roughly that much money even if they happen to live next to campus.
> Cost of living expenses will be incurred whether you go to college or not.
Again sure, but they impact how much money someone can save from a summer job. If you’re making 15$ an hour while living at home with free room and board then you can save quite a bit. However, that’s far from universal for most people trying to make it on with a high school diploma alone they simply don’t generate a significant surplus every week.
Schools include loans in that financial assistance category. So sure most revive “assistance” but that bill comes due. VT under grads can’t actually come up with that kind of money thus the loans. ~30k of loans * 4 years = 120K which isn’t extreme for undergraduate, but ignores interest which will greatly compound if someone seeks further education.
Thus why actual college affordability is important rather than just loans. Failing to become a doctor is financial suicide for most people in the US. Which plays a huge role in our ruinous healthcare costs.
> The average net tuition and fees paid by first-time, full-time in-state students at public four-year institutions was estimated to be $2,640, the lowest it’s been since 2006-07, down more than a $1,000 from a peak in 2012-13 of $3,720 (in 2021 dollars).
Even if you have to take out a loan while attending a state school, it doesn't have to be a huge loan. And even a crappy part-time job will reduce that burden, even if it doesn't cover your tuition fully.
Many schools require students to pay for room and board even if they live nearby. Schools are hiding tuition costs in those fees and really need people to pay them.
Anyone who went to community college and makes the median wage ($69,717) in America is doing way better financially than someone who went school for free in France and makes median wage (€22,140). There's really no contest on prosperity for college grads even when you include ridiculous student loans (median for US: $22K).
it still make zero sense to me why student loan payments on hold. should we also put car loan payment on hold? credit card payments?
yes..people took loans without thinking if they pay off debt. is it every borrower? No.
easy scheme for political party to get votes. make perfect sense to me why sofi would sue.
i always think to my home country. being born in USA like winning lottery. just green card and no citizenship is like lottery. endless opportunity to do something in USA. no mentally and physically ok adult in USA have reason to be in poverty.
but of course USA people thinking government magically solve all of it. true irony that developed country fall into our third world thinking mindset.
constant load shedding? parliaments job to fix.
people dont want to obey traffic rule? could it be something with our culture? of course not. government problem to fix.
Ok..trash everywhere in street? government problem to fix. i will say government should fix it, ignoring that it is myself throwing that trash out on the street instead of in bin even when rubbish bin is right there at hand distance.
not enough jobs? government should fix by hiring everyone.
do we trust government, no. but my party is good and yours corrupt. if my prime minister favorite actually shoots child it is okay and i will justify it.
thats the type of mindset. every problem i have.. it is someone else’s fault. i have zero responsibility.