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Comment by stevev | Hacker News Reader

The 25-year import rule serves as evidence of how the United States has struggled in competition and developing vehicles over the past several decades.

Toyota and Subaru are present in the United States because there is an incentive to manufacture them locally, which serves as a valuable learning experience for the US.

Thus the United States' car manufacturers are either perceived as being of low quality or lagging behind their competitors, leading to the country being utilized as a third-party for inexpensive assembly.

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There are a couple issues with your assessment.

A) most cars manufactured by European and Japanese brands are built in Mexico and direct imported via NAFTA/USMCA. The fact that Toyota and Honda choose to continue to do manufacturing in the United States is probably seen as a boon to those local communities.

B) the "low quality" image of American brands is pretty limited to the United States, like a lot of American products (California wine, for instance, is generally bottom shelf in the US but well regarded internationally). In Russia, Ford used to be their top marquee. Ford and GM are both huge in Oceania. In LATAM, they're seen as a step up from Japanese and Chinese brands and Volkswagen. In Europe, they're not generally perceived as low-quality; instead, the perception is that they're too large and fuel inefficient for most European roads/cities.

> In Europe, they're not generally perceived as low-quality; instead, the perception is that they're too large and fuel inefficient for most European roads/cities.

The only American brands I see in Europe are either old Chevrolets (manufactured in Germany by Opel when they were part of GM) or Jeep/Dodge/RAM trucks and similar which are owned by Stellantis (the merger of PSA (Peugeot, Citroen) and FCA (Fiat, Chrysler)) and manufactured in Italy. So they aren't know for their poor quality because they're made in the EU, in the same factories that make other known models, on the same bases (e.g. an Opel Ampera and a Chevrolet Volt are the same car, from the same factory, different badge, slightly different interior, slightly different exterior), but they are known as shit inefficient cars that mostly assholes buy.

The only American American cars (not built in the EU with an American badge slapped on the front, but produced in Mexico) that I can think of that I have seen in Europe are Chrysler PT Cruisers which are universally known as shit.

Funny you mention Jeep - in the early aughts the same manufacturer who made the M-Class in Europe also made Grand Cherokees (Magna Steyr)

Apparently they also made PT Cruisers for a brief period - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Steyr#Production

I often see Fords and Teslas

Ah true, forgot about Ford, they're rare but present; also built in the EU though, even if Ford are a one-brand company (after the sale of Volvo/Jaguar/Land Rover). In Bulgaria there's a joke along the lines of "Do you know why Fords have such wide windshield/windscreens? So that everyone can see the idiots that bought them.", but I'm not actually aware of them having a bad reputation (unlike say old Opels that are known as very rust prone).

Teslas are a new phenomenon and indeed getting more and more prominent in some niches, but it seems it's mostly taxis and uber drivers, at least in France. I suppose the theatrics of Tesla's prominent CEO will significantly hamper their expansion, and pretty much most car manufacturers have caught up. Around where I live I see more Renault Zoe and VW ID.3s than Teslas for personal use.

I’m suspicious of your claims in B. I can’t speak for every country you mentioned but in Australia (which constitutes most of the Oceania market), Ford/GM are not huge here at all. I also didn’t think I’ve ever heard people speak favourably of their reliability over Japanese brands. Tesla is perceived quite differently though and is gaining popularity.

Last year Ford sold about 1/4 the vehicles Toyota did (they were the 6th best selling brand in Australia), while GM/Tesla didn’t make the top 10 (https://www.racv.com.au/royalauto/transport/cars/australian-...).

Historically GM (under the Holden brand) and Ford were popular because they sold locally designed and manufactured v6 sedans and utes (like small pickup trucks). These cars were always perceived as Australian, not American.

They don’t locally manufacture anymore and have lost most of the Australian market.

> They don’t locally manufacture anymore and have lost most of the Australian market.

Ok, sure. Rephrase that to "historically, as of a decade ago", if you like.

The point was more that the low-quality association was a more American phenomenon than anything. Internationally, they were either perceived fine or unpopular for other reasons.

For some reason there’s a niche of people that drive RAM Vans in the Netherlands. Not sure why exactly that brand and model but it’s the only ‘Murican style trick you see on our roads.

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