Hacker News Reader

Comment by tinco | Hacker News Reader

Companionable. It's the most direct translation, and it's very close to how we use the word "gezellig". We just use the word a lot more frequently. The warm feeling you get when you are with friendly company, even if that's just your own company, that's what we call companionable and it's a theme that's central to Dutch culture. If you'll agree Christmas is the most companionable time of the year, I think you're very close to understanding to why the Dutch want everything to be companionable.

View on HN

I'd suggest "convivial" is a little closer.

Oh interesting, yeah at least the dictionary seems to hit all the keywords except friendly, hitting social instead which might or might not be accurate. "Living-together-ness" would be the literal translation, which is a bit weird but if that's how it's used then at least in use it might be a lot closer than companionable.

From the perspective of a southern European, neither "convivial" nor "companionable" are the words that spring to mind when I think of Dutch people :)

From the perspective of a Dutchman: same. "Gezellig" really doesn't sum up the heart of Dutch culture in the slightest - not to mention it's old, if you show up at a party and someone goes "gezellig", it's time to leave, this is your grandparents' party. Or you have some extremely boring middle class "huisje boompje beestje" ("buy a house, plant a tree, get a pet" to refer to settling down and never aspiring to anything after) friends, of course.

What kind of aspirations do you expect from most people? I always thought being content with a simple life was part of the magic.

Given Dutch demographics and prevalence of cheap (on the world stage) and highly regarded university degrees? Quite a lot. Dutch culture was shaped by entrepreneurship more than anything else (Except maybe plausibly deniable exploitation of entire people groups up to extremely recently, a cultural trait shared by an embarassingly large number of European countries).

If this word means both of the definitions defines by the commenters above that'd make it a Janus word, or autantonym.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auto-antonym

We are a special bunch, I’ll give you that.

From the perspective of a fellow southern European living in NL, there’s definitely a different way of interpreting it.

Gezellig is also… an atmosphere, a vibe. You are sitting alone in your garden at dusk in a summer evening, there’s a cool breeze, very soft garden lights are on, just enough to let you read your book… that can be gezellig, even if you’re alone. Or you’re in a pub with 10 friends, chugging beers… also gezellig. Dining in a southern European restaurant with bright lights… not very gezellig, you’ll probably need people around to make up for that :)

In a sense, Dutch people are more convivial than us: they can find conviviality without having people around. But that’s the point I guess: “convivial” is a limiting translation to begin with.

IMO, the vibe thing is how I usually use it (Dutchie over here).

It's basically similar to to "hyggelig" in Norwegian/Danish?

Yeah, that’s my takeaway too

As a native Dutch speaker who also speaks Norwegian, it's exactly that.

I’ve usually translated it to “cozy” with a bit of “at ease” and “comfortable”. But, I’m an American that speaks some Dutch (all my family are from the Netherlands, but I’m born in USA), so I’m not completely fluent.

Belgian (Flemish) that speaks English. I feel that those have pretty similar meanings. Gezellig can be used when talking about groups of people though, but not sure if it is used often in that context.

Mandarin has a word for that as well, I've forgotten it.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com