Gezellig – a word that encompasses the heart of Dutch Culture
dutchamsterdam.nl
dutchamsterdam.nl
Gezellig is also… an atmosphere, a vibe. You are sitting alone in your garden at dusk in a summer evening, there’s a cool breeze, very soft garden lights are on, just enough to let you read your book… that can be gezellig, even if you’re alone. Or you’re in a pub with 10 friends, chugging beers… also gezellig. Dining in a southern European restaurant with bright lights… not very gezellig, you’ll probably need people around to make up for that :)
In a sense, Dutch people are more convivial than us: they can find conviviality without having people around. But that’s the point I guess: “convivial” is a limiting translation to begin with.
P.S. Link from the post doesn't open in Russia ("Country blocked") and I had to use VPN to read it lol. It's ONGEZELLIG to block someone read article about cozy and ecologic living.
Blyat for example almost reads like blaat which to us is the sound a sheep makes. It also refers to blaten, talking nonsense.
The English word cunt sounds like the Dutch kunt which means can (je kunt means you can). Kunt gets censored in a popular game, even if the rest of sentence is Dutch.
Then we have German where an English listener might think bisschen means bitch, and generally an English speaker might think a German is angry while its just the sound of the language (in contrast to, say, French).
Recently, some Dutch song (I think it was Belgian?) went viral in Ukraine as well.
Anyway, as a native Dutch speaker with autism, gezellig is equal to Orwellian double speak like Russian pravda (theres other examples, too). If its gezellig for others, it might very well not be for me. Or its tokkie level (tokkie = white trash). In other words, not a word I value when others use it.
EDIT: I believe you might find this song by a comedian weird for different reasons than intended: https://youtu.be/ATdRtTtzZ3c (he is singing good morning, good afternoon, its like this: I am a customer).
And the Canadians giggled.
Ahhhh a distant cousin to the "Scunthorpe problem" - English and Dutch are not so dissimilar after all!
Related problem I saw recently, guy called Nasser had the "ass" in his name in some game's chat replaced with the string "***" taking a very common name and making it look like he named himself perhaps the worst word in the English language. Very unfortunate.
Pakled is a specific race of aliens in the game and universe (TNG Samaritan Snare), but would get caught in the filter (Assuming due to Pakistanis?)
Sort of like saying the word "awesome" encompasses the heart of American culture.
Its a type of fluff article that you can find about many mundane words from around the world, trying to make them into some wonderful concept that's just what the US is missing.
I guess the authors of such articles need to pay their bills too, but it's a bit surprising to see one on here.
Also, there is ikigai.
And sisu.
I guess the real secret to happiness is socialized medicine, which kind of takes away some of the non-hyggeikigaisisu nature of existence elsewhere.
For context, this word was a key plot point in this last night's episode of the show.
And (spoiler) no sex or drugs, teases to the contrary notwithstanding (not that there’s anything wrong with sex or drugs, but that’s not what this show is about).
They did. Yes, they did.
It's a streaming show, so they're not bound to specific episode lengths. If they have a story that warrants longer, they have the ability to stretch it. I think that's great.
This is one of my personal top episodes alongside season 2's Rainbow.
Also the author complains of the overcommercialization of the Danish Hygge, pretty sure gezellig is there already.
As a Dutch person, worth pointing out that we Dutch people like using words in an ironic sense. So using the word gezellig in situations are anything but gezellig is ironic and therefore something people might do. But it adds to the confusion.
But basically it usually refers to situations, locations, or meetings of people being either gezellig (enjoyable, agreeable, etc.) or the opposite, ongezellig.
For me (in Belgium) I hear and use it in that ironic/mocking sense way more often. Whereas indeed in the Netherlands it is super common to use it in the normal sense.
Nice that you mention "lekker", that means something like "tasty" or "nice" but it can also ooze sarcasm and be used to turn just about anything into a sneer.
https://medium.com/@Thrillist/how-the-irish-ship-entire-pubs...
>How the Irish ship entire pubs around the world
>You may not have been to Ireland, but you’ve still pulled up a stool to a Dublin-made bar counter.
[1]: "gnarly" being one of those English words that can mean almost anything depending on context. In particular, similar to "Gezellig" it can mean both something like "very good / excellent" AND "horrible/bad". It's also frequently used to mean something like "difficult/dangerous/challenging".
- Italian: words that express refined craftsmanship: sprezatura, virtuoso, capo-lavoro, affresco, al-dente, allegro/adagio, ...
- French: life must be appreciated to its full: joie-de-vivre, bon-vivant, coquette, lingerie, gourmet, finesse, chic, ..
- Japanese: a very sharp capability to appreciate what others can't: wabi-sabi, umami, satori, ...
- English: a very ingrained respect for democracy and its values: accountability, grassroots/astroturf, pork-barrel, bullying, harassment, lobying, ...
- German: a clear eyed perception that the world is dangerous and mean: torchlusspanic, schadenfreude,...
- Brazilian Portuguese: all that matters are emotional and physical connections: cafuné, xamego, sacanagem, ...
Edit: From the comments on that BBC article:
Glasgow woman sits in the dentist's chair.
"Comfy?" says the dentist.
"Govan" says the woman.
Edit2: When I was a child I would have asked where someone was from by saying: "Far are ye fae"....
A steak can be undercooked but never will be al-dente.
Undercooked can mean improperly cooked, al-dente always means properly not cooked too much.
An engineer might say that al dente has more shear strength left than fully cooked.
So in this case, al dente means cooked to perfection. Not too much, not too little, and is reflective of the craftsman’s skill.
Whether a word is untranslatable very much depends on the language you're translating to. "Schadenfreude" translates quite directly to "leedvermaak" in Dutch, even though English has no word for it (therefore adopting it as a loan word).
Personally, I've never really found a word in another language that encompasses the same meaning and connotation as "gezellig", though there are close contenders (like "hygge" in Danish). There are also words I know of in other languages that are in the same category, describing a feeling or perception that's impossible to explain (and may be shaped by culture as much as language).
There are definitely English words that have the same problem, but they're still quite rare.
But what I can say is that these languages introduced these words, perceptions, themes and discourses into worldwide discussion.
In Latin-derived languages the English words I mentioned are either directly imported or very new. One example: in Spanish and Portuguese the word "assedio" has appeared as a substitute for harassment. But this is a very recent phenomenon, until recently wife-beating wasn't even a crime in some Spanish/Portuguese speaking countries.
In French, there is "harcèlement" for harassment, but according to WordReference.com, the closest one-word translations for bullying are "harcèlement" or "intimidation" (which appear closer to harassment and intimidation in English) [1]. Similarly, according to SpanishDictionary.com, the closest translation of bullying is the Anglicism "el bullying," with "intimidación" also used as a close but not exact equivalent [2].
Similarly, the closest equivalent to "accountability" according to WordReference is "responsabilité," with Spanish similarly using "responsabilidad" as its closest equivalent according to SpanishDictionary. Perhaps "responsabilité" and "responsabilidad" can carry the same connotations as the English word for "accountability" depending on the context, but it's true that there are no entries for standalone words in French or Spanish in these dictionaries that carry the exact associations as "accountability" in English.
The author writes that Oprah Winfrey is "gezellig," but it's a bit awkward to say that a person is "cozy." The English usage is correct to say that a person is "comforting." The author also writes that cheering on a sports team is "gezellig," along with going out in the evening with friends. But these activities seem high-energy to me, so "comforting" doesn't feel quite right (where as "gezellig" would feel completely right).
So, "gezellig" looks like a sentiment that is a mixture of "warm, comforting, and at-home," which can describe a person and also activities that are active and not necessarily passive. It's translatable, so I disagree with the author's premise that the word "gezellig" can't be translated, as the word is clearly translated by the author with abundant examples. However, I agree with the author's impression that a single English word cannot define the term.
[Edit] Maybe that explains them having two words for it?
Look at the first picture in TFA. That's gesellig. Having coffee on a busy terrace on a sunny day is gesellig.
Spending time in front of a fireplace while it rains outside is cozy, not gesellig. Unless, as the article points out, you have friends over that are gesellig.
It shares a root with "gesels" which means "to chat". And you have the word "geselskap" which is similar to "audience", but used in a more social context.
Gesellig is all about having a good time with a fun crowd. Cozy can be this too, but it's more restrictive I think. Playing a drinking game while in you underwear in the snow might not be cozy, but it's sure as hell gesellig!
I would describe spending time in front of a fireplace while it rains outside to be cozy (or "knus" in Dutch) as well, not gezellig. However, you could describe the fireplace and the room it's in as gezellig.
I'm not sure if I'd call that a translation, though, because of how the languages have evolved. I wouldn't call color and colour translations of each other, and gesellig and gezellig are similarly close in written form and etymological history.
In contrast, I find it interesting that the meaning of "gesels" and "geselskap" in Afrikaans is so different from "gezel" and "gezelschap" in Dutch. A "gezel" is a friend, mate, or some other person who stands with you; a gezelschap is a group of gezellen. I'm not aware of any similar verb ("vergezellen", perhaps, which means "to accompany"). Sadly, the Afrikaans Wiktionary is not as complete as the Dutch Wiktionary so I can't easily verify the exact relationships between these words.
Interestingly, we also have the word knus, totally forgot about it. We also have "snoesig", which is used to describe being tucked in or wrapped in a blanket.
So your description of geselskap (group of gezellen) is EXACTLY what geselskap means. Its a group of good or fun people, sometimes friends but not always. We don't have the concept of "gezel" though. Interestingly we also have the concept of bad (slegte) geselskap, which describes when you associate with the "wrong kind of people".
We ALSO have vergesel, which is the verb for accompany. We have "metgesel", which is the noun given to the person accompanying you i.e. escort/chaperone or date.
So for those who are not native Dutch and Afrikaans: in the 1650s the Dutch came to South Africa and started a colony. Over the centuries the Dutch dialect this side changed and picked up all sorts of words from local and other imported languages. In the early 1900s it oficially became it's own language. For a long time before that it was known as "kitchen Dutch" among other things, as it was the creole spoken by the slaves and servants of the Western Cape colonists. It's trivial for me to read and comprehend Dutch text, and a speaker only needs to slow down a little and I can follow what's being said well enough.
- I don't think you can say someone has a cosy personality
- I don't think you can say "how cosy for you to be here" or "let's keep it cosy in here" when the mood is turning sour
- I don't think you would call going shopping with a group of friends cosy
- I'm not sure if you can have a cosy conversation, but maybe you can?
The inverse is true of many Dutch words with a common German origin as well. We straight-up imported "überhaupt" because there's no commonly used, single word that expresses the same particular thing (other than another loan word).
Portuguese: saudade, fado
About the feeling of missing something, somebody or past times and complaining about the inevitability of it. Why? Portugal is a country of explorers, settlers and lost territories.
My understanding is that craic means to have a good time with good people, and that's exactly what gesellig is.
Gesellig might have broader application in this context though, as an event can be gesellig, a person can be gesellig. It's am adjective. It seems craic is used for all sorts of other terms which do not apply here.
Maybe we do have translations for them. Maybe the English word for schadenfreude is "schadenfreude." (But yes, if you want to say I'm cheating, that's fine.)
At least, that's what I made out of, but I welcome a proper explanation from a native speaker!
We've got "to get a hard on for" (or, "to get wet for") used for "likes very much", in "low" English registers. A bit less politely, perhaps (I don't have a read on exactly how offensive this usage is? If it is at all?) "to be gay for", as in "Tim's gay for Zelda games" is somewhat common. May have originated with or been popularized by South Park? Not sure. Though, unlike "sexy", none of those are common in business outside incredibly-brotastic environments.
At the same time in Dutch, we use it also, exactly the same word "Geil" with exactly the same sexual meaning, but for us it has a bit of a dirty feeling.
I had conversation with Germans: "oh that means horny for us", they: "yeah for us too".
As well as I find Horny in itself a bit more invasive then sexy.
I'm not even sure where its from. Probably some comedian.
Tina, was kosten die kondome? Tina replies: 3,99. To which a customer says: Nein, 2,99, sie sind in Sonderausverkauf.
My extremely limited German translates "gespart" to "saved", and "Wochen" to "weeks". I'm guessing that the two liner actually translates into something like "Have you come? / Weeks ago", but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around it.
With regard to the other quote: a man cannot save sperm for weeks, he'll have a wet dream eventually, after approx one week. So its either a straight up lie, an overstatement / white lie, someone who doesn't know such (though we don't know if the person asking knows such or sees through it), or its taken honestly and literally (he's saved up, but who knows how full the bucket is). Since we both have autism, I suppose we go for the last explanation.
Edit: idiom
Gesellig is also used for occasions, like a geselliger Abend as also listed on the Leo link. In Switzerland it's sometimes also used for places like a geselliges Restaurant. From that perspective I use the German word in pretty much the same way.
Side note: The adjective likely comes from "Gesellschaft," which can mean "society" but also "company."
In Bavaria and probably the rest of (Southern?) Germany as well. I doubt there's much difference between the German and Dutch words.
But then my experience in Denmark was very narrowly spent with my ex-wife’s family there, so maybe I’d have gotten hygge with it eventually.
Its a funny case of words shifting meaning, while still sounding similar.
The article makes an impression that "gezellig" is somewhat close to French "savoir-vivre", "la vie est belle", Italian "dolce vita", and maybe even Latin "carpe diem"?
It looks like multiple cultures have similar appreciation to spending one's time well, but also focus on different aspects of what "well" means.
I don't speak those languages, but I don't think those words are an apt translation. The word doesn't really describe a way of life, or the enjoyment of life in particular, it's more of a vibe or an emotional state or an emotional association to a certain place, event, or situation. The English word "convivial" seems to come pretty close, though from the example sentences I can find I still think the meaning is slightly different.
I find it quite difficult to accurately describe my perception of the word "gezellig" without anecdotes of shared experiences. I believe savoir-vivre and dolce vita are similar in that way; there are direct translations, but they all miss some element of what the original meant.
At least as a native that's how I always interpret it. It's always in a setting with people.
Gezellig is different, it doesn't just mean "good" or "nice", it evokes a very specific feeling.
That said, I moved to a warmer country and while I enjoy the sun, I’m getting really nostalgic for the pleasant Dutch temperatures.
It is like trying to map integers to floats. You can get a close approximation, but a conversion doesn't always make sense.
Here's an example which (again, for me) doesn't quite fit: when talking about a party with music and dancing and saying it is 'chill' we'd mean that it was relaxed, enough space to dance, no drunk idiots, fun overall, and so on. We might add to it that it was 'gezellig', not use instead, but then we'd mean there were also lot of friends around and/or new friends being made. While there's a link with being chill, they could just as well be orthogonal. Like 'it was gezellig but too bad it was so crowded' means it wasn't chill at all.
Technically not, but practically it really helps your chances of being correct.
Without knowing both languages you’re more or less guessing.
It’s really hard for something to be gezellig when you are alone, it almost always refers to the people around you, or a location that you’d be happy to meet people. Like, an empty house or cafe is basically never gezellig.
My god I never expected that would be so hard to explain.
Like, you could go by yourself to a little out of the way cottage, hearthfire burning, super cozy! But it’s not gezellig, because there’s no other people involved.
Did you mistake me, or did I somehow come off as excessively self-righteous?
“No, "chill" and "gezellig" are not the same.
"Chill" is an English term used to describe a relaxed and easy-going atmosphere or situation. It can refer to a person's demeanor, a social setting, or an activity that is low-key and stress-free.
"Gezellig" is a Dutch term that is difficult to translate directly to English, but it generally refers to a cozy and convivial atmosphere or feeling of togetherness. It can refer to a physical space, a social gathering, or a mood. It is often associated with warmth, comfort, and hospitality, and is an important aspect of Dutch culture.”
When you celebrate Christmas.. gezellig
When you have dinner.. gezellig
Also, something can look like it's gezellig, which translates more like cozy
For example.. Christmas decoration, gezellig!