Hacker News Reader

Comment by makeitdouble | Hacker News Reader

Making the calculation part tedious is as shifty as it can be. The cash part might be a tad more reasonable though.

For context, other countries are also progressively nudging people away from cash, or any in person payment means really. France gov will straight refuse any payment above 300E at the tax office, be it by cash, check or credit card. The goal I assume is straight up to simplify their operation, as there's no middle-men, and they otherwise do serious efforts to make it easy for the tax payer.

View on HN

Just want to reinforce, probably the euro does not, but all US currency contains the phrase "this note legal tender for all debts, public and private" which indicates that the IRS must accept cash, they can't refuse it.

The “private” part of that is not enforceable. Though I’d personally love if it was so I could buy a cup of coffee at an airport in 2023 without using an app or credit card.

yes, the private part of that is enforceable, but it says "debt". So, a retailer can say "no cash" but if you somehow are in debt to a retailer (say for example that you already ate the meal at the restaurant), you are allowed to settle your debt with cash, all debts, public and private. If they try take you to court or try to press charges, if you're waving cash, they are out of luck.

I don’t think buying a cup of coffee counts as paying a debt. Could a private debt collector legally refuse cash? (I’ve always presumed they couldn’t)

The debt is created when you order the coffee and they confirm your order.

No. You don’t owe anything until the coffee is in your hand.

Or until they cancel the transaction.

If you order the coffee, they say “okay that’ll be $2.87”, and you try to pay with cash, they can cancel the order. Poof, no debt.

Now if they drop the check at your table after you’ve enjoyed the cup of coffee, it’s different IMO.

But if they made it clear at the time of ordering that they didn’t accept cash, then a customer who orders knowing that’s the only payment medium they have would presumably be the one breaching the contract when they weren’t able to pay? I guess the remedy to that would be to create a debt, but I’d also presume that could also include any other damages incurred by the coffee vendor for facilitating the cash payment.

The debt doesn't vanish, you've just transferred it back to the company. They aren't making coffee without cost.

They're free to waive your debt rather than accept payment.

No, the debt is still there as they've paid for the beans, staff, processing etc.

They'd temporarily moved their debt onto you and now had to accept it back again. But it hasn't gone away.

Yes it is gone, it's considered a loss.

Aren't there safeguards around that notion ?

For instance, someone should probably be barred from paying a personal debt of 1000 dollars in 1 cent coins. I couldn't google my way through the US code, for illustration this is the Singapore limits:

https://www.mas.gov.sg/currency/circulation-currency/accepti...

Unsurprisingly France also has rules on what limits can be set on accepting cash:

https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F10999#...).

I have a family member that works for a county court and they've had court ordered payments paid with a wheelbarrow of pennies before. Made the person count out the entire thing before accepting it.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com