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Comment by londons_explore | Hacker News Reader

Most washing machines will use more $ in energy in their lifespan than they cost to buy. That means it is usually worth replacing an old but working one with an energy efficient one merely for the energy savings.

A modern EU machine will wash a large (10kg) load of clothes for 0.5 kwh of energy and 50 liters of water (13 gallons).

An old 1980's machine might use 4.5 kwh of electricity, and 180 liters of water.

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It’s interesting because although not unimportant, the outcome I’m looking for when buying a washing machine is how well it cleans clothing. Of course price, speed, and efficiency cone into play. But I think many efficient machines do a poor job at cleaning.

Of course different people have different requirements. If you rarely have soiled clothing maybe it doesn’t matter. If you have kids and jobs/hobbies that soil clothing you may also have different expectations.

Also where you are in the world. In the USA energy is generally cheap and on many places water is plentiful. If I were in Germany where energy policy has been poorly managed I’d probably have to consider efficiency more.

> But I think many efficient machines do a poor job at cleaning.

Not in my experience. A good high efficiency front loader tends to get the clothes cleaner - and notably with much less wear than conventional top loaders. The money savings also come from clothing replacement as well.

Water use aside it's just better technology. Complexity is an issue, but I've had good luck by staying brands and models proven for reliability.

The problem with front loaders, and it's a fatal flaw unfortunately, is they unavoidably have mold and mildew problems due to the design. This makes them an invalid option in my opinion as I don't want mold and mildew spores in my home. They also begin to stink and your clothing can pick it up over time as it gets worse.

The other problem is many top loaders today are garbage. In order to be effective they do need a good agitator and they do need use a lot of water. The water part doesn't really matter to me though as tap water is so cheap we're talking a few cents per load.

Also speed. A front loader takes a long time. A good top loader (like Speed Queen) is done in 30m.

> is they unavoidably have mold and mildew problems due to the design.

Keep the door open. The water evaporates. Never had a problem avoiding mold.

It’s more about residues that get left behind and trapped in the rubber gasket. Keeping a dour open, although helpful, simply isn’t enough. A big part of the problem is due to the limited water use. Things don’t fully rinse.

I don’t know, it’s a major problem that people report and I’ve experienced myself. There’s even a fan you can buy and put into the machine. But hey if you haven’t experienced problems then that’s great.

As long as we're swapping anecdotes, I spent a day cutting MDF for a project and came home just covered in fine brown dust. The place we rented before we moved had an LG HE front-loader.

My blue pants remained brown from the dust for a couple of cycles. My carpenter neighbor has had the same experience with HE machines and has gone to a Speed Queen top-loader. He finds it much more satisfactory as well.

You don't have to go by anecdotes, you can go by published testing then. Dust may be a special case, and perhaps certain occupations may be better off with a top loader for work clothes, but for everyday stains and body secretions front loaders work better and wear out clothes slower.

I'm not in the anti top-loader Speed Queen cult at all... but it is that on the internet, a cult (when I hear things like mold is "unavoidable", and basically you'd have to be an idiot to consider anything other than a Speed Queen top loader that is my conclusion) -- but most people are simply better served with a front loader.

I’m sure it’s just an example but being european I am surprised at the 10kg load. Most people I know hover around ~5-7 kg max capacity for their washing machines. They’re usually placed in bathrooms or kitchens since not a lot of people have space for a separate washing machine room since also not a lot of people have dryers in the EU (at least they’re not standard, they’re considered extra).

Not your point but just adding my two eurocents

Taking a random appliance vendor's list of machines, there are a good few 9 or 10kg ones, but 6-7kg is also common: https://powercity.ie/groups/view?grp=40&class=01 (the very most expensive one they sell does _18kg_; I had no idea that was a thing...)

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