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Comment by chucknthem | Hacker News Reader

I have a rare reaction in this HN crowd. I found the first half completely fascinating. I was born in Yunnan and familiar with some of the region, but left at an early age with little memory of it now. It’s surreal to see this remote region of China written about in English this way. Reading it makes me yearn to visit and see everything for myself!

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Dali is maybe my favorite town in China. Not popular enough to be overwhelmed by tourists, but still possessing a lot of bars and restaurants that you could ostensibly just spend a few weeks there having fun. There's the lake, the mountains, the hot springs, the night life.

I've been to Lijiang a few times now (not on purpose, but we had a few company retreats there), and it works really well even if its a hot place on the tourist map these days. But the first time, we did an overland from Chengdu to Lijiang, and I just remember Zhongdian (sometimes called Shang-ri-la for publicity) as an absolutely magical big city in the Tibetan plateau (likewise Litang in Sichuan).

Lijiang is absolute garbage, it's all night clubs and totally ruins the old town's feeling. I tried to get a beer for 120 RMB, but they said they were out and offered the 150 RMB beer, so I noped out. I got a cocktail for like 100 RMB, but they didn't even shake it with ice for me. WTF

150 RMB is $21.71 now, but it used to be almost $25 at that time's exchange rate

In comparison, I got some of the best cocktails I've ever had at a bar in Dali for 65 RMB

> it's all night clubs and totally ruins the old town's feeling.

Ya, totally agree. But there are nice things to do around Lijiang, at least (mountains, gorges). And I have fond memories drinking with Chinese friends there. You aren't going to get great drinks in tourist towns anyways, not like the fancy bars in Beijing/Shanghai.

Beijing bars are too expensive or the drinks are too weak. I haven't found a bar that is actually a good value for cocktails, so I usually go out for beers which are surprisingly good

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g303781-d12429...

this bar in Dali is the best one I've been to in China

You need to know the scene. But my info is 7 years out of date.

Beijing is so big, but if you go into a random bar it's usually crap, I wonder why that is

Heh im French, and when time came to emigrate because I had become fluent in English and tired of France, the choice between the US and China was trivial: I chose China. It's more atheist, safer, more optimistic generally.

I think we ignore it right now, but there s a little migration wave towards China that goes beyond "rich executive parachuted in Shanghai branch", and while we re far from democracy or any kind of "Chinese dream", well, I think I ended up much much better in China than I would have in the US...

China is frigging great, the people are amazing, and we all will build this country despite the communists and the americans doing all they can to fuck it up :D Come back!

You seem surprisingly certain that you’d have been worse in the US even though you never moved there in the first place.

On one hand, being convinced you made all the right decisions is great for your happiness.

On the other hand, as a fellow European who emigrated, and who has faced no issues due “religiosity, lack of safety or pessimism” in the US, I still have no clue if I would have “ended up better” in China or the US.

I see the opposite: European friends who moved to China in the last 15 years leaving, because they can no longer implicitly support an increasingly authoritarian regime so close to Russia.

Covid, China's response to the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and the way Hong Kong's separate systems were overridden were all factors, plus propaganda-supported anti-European racism for two people I know who lived in "smaller" cities.

What a refreshing perspective. Can you elaborate more on the pros? And what you see as the USA's cons?

>we all will build this country despite the communists

Yeaah, Russians were doing a good job building the country despite their government, but oppressive dictatorships have a way of manifesting themselves in your life, even if you don't manifest in theirs.

> Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you.

-- Pericles

Can you give any comment on the experience living and working in China as a foreign national? How open is the country to permanent immigration/what is the process like? What levels of fluency and literacy are required?

Yes its the amercans doing all they can to fuck it up ... poor CCP with all their homegrown tech and businesses. Why won't they let them be?

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