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Comment by zmgsabst | Hacker News Reader

The bill which prohibits discussing sexuality with children under nine?

Shock. Gasp. Horror.

I think we do real damage to LGBT causes when we allow their sexuality to be a pretense for inappropriate conduct with children — such as misrepresenting a bill saying you can’t discuss sexuality with young children as “Don’t Say Gay”.

You’re portraying LGBT people as pedophiles to score cheap political points — and Disney fell for the same trap, as their punishment is for sexualizing children… and nothing to do with LGBT rights.

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So Desantis “punished” Disney for “sexualizing children” and not for publicly condemning the law?

But the law as it is actually used would never punish a man for saying he went on vacation with his wife. But would definitely punish a man for saying he went on vacation with his husband to children.

By the way, I live in Orlando, so I’m not a tight jean wearing hipster living in California who only knows what I hear from the National news.

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/florida-teacher-all...

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-politics-and-policy/-can...

Then you should get informed about what the law actually does — rather than incorrect hypotheticals. Let’s save outrage for what actually happens, not our fantasies.

And yes — Disney publicly condemned a law protecting children from inappropriate conduct; ie, Disney publicly came out in favor of sexual discussions with children.

That’s what led to consequences.

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Your first example is about a teacher who was fired before this for reasons related to not following the curriculum.

But it correctly describes this law:

> Officially titled the Parental Rights in Education bill, the legislation bans teaching about sexual orientation or gender identity “in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.”

What about that do you specifically object to?

So now you think that the government should “punish” companies who speak out against laws?

Do you really think the law will be used against teaching about straight couples?

> inappropriate conduct with children

Please specify, precisely, what can and cannot be discussed within the bounds of universal appropriateness with children under the age of 10. If your response is not universal, then you simply reveal that the law under discussion is authoritarian and has no business existing.

Children under the age of 10 can be victims of abuse. Most kids by age 10 have a rough idea about the mechanics of sex. Children can live in homes with loved ones who are gay, lesbian, transgender, asexual, intersex, queer, and more. Children may themselves be homosexual and realize this about themselves before age 10.

An authoritarian approach is to ban discussion and attempt to wrest control in domains the state has no business being in.

A wiser approach is to lay down recommended principles, and allow common law to adopt those which actually are useful for the society of the governed.

The job of government is to establish common norms for appropriate behavior — from murder to inappropriate conduct with children.

There is no universal morality and this is within the bounds of what laws already do:

Regulate the conduct of a licensed profession in their conduct with children.

I agree the state has no business in this area — which is why this law prohibits certain conduct at places the state obligates children to attend. Nobody is saying children can’t have those things, discuss them with families, friends, etc. This is a restriction on teachers, to maintain professional behavior with young children.

Thanks for comfirming the point that the universality of the bill in unachievable, thus making the don't say gay bill straight up bad, authoritatian policy.

So do you think the same people would object to “good Christian values”? Teaching about the “traditional nuclear family”?

The bill applies to all age groups. It bans discussion of gender for children less than 10. And also prohibits instruction "in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards".

The law makes it illegal for a young child with gay parents to draw a family picture and discuss it in classroom.

No it doesn’t.

What it does is what you actually cited:

> prohibits instruction "in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards"

I think it’s telling that you made up a fantasy about “kids with gay parents can’t draw their family!” rather than the actual content — which I cited.

This is what I mean by conflating gay rights with inappropriate conduct with children.

Yes and laws against “sodomy” weren’t meant to target gay people.

Do you really think parents would use the law to target a man talking about being married to a woman and not a man married to a man.

Let’s save our outrage for things that actually happen.

But yes — I think many parents would be uncomfortable taking children to burlesque shows, rather than drag shows. And similarly uncomfortable with a heterosexual teacher who discussed their sexuality in the way that this prohibits.

We don’t teach young kids about sexuality or gender identity at a young age, regardless.

That’s not the job of school teachers.

You are dramatically narrowing, in your description, what the law actually broadly prohibits. It isn't about burlesque shows or about a teacher discussing sex with a young student.

The text of (this portion) of the law is:

> Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.

It says very clearly that a instruction about gender identity MAY NOT OCCUR before grade 4 - and after that must occur in accordance with state standards and to a vague standard of "appropriateness".

These same people would never object to a teacher talking about a “normal” heterosexual couple.

They don’t just object to teachers talking about their sexuality. They object to admitting that gay people exists - ie a man saying “I went to the movies with my husband”.

It does, actually. A teacher can't lead a discussion of gender identity for young children, making a discussion of this family illegal under the law.

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