Hacker News Reader

Comment by cactus2093 | Hacker News Reader

cactus2093

I just can't take any discussion of "skills" seriously that equates skill to some formal certification or degree.

As a software engineer, basically all the skills I use to do my job on a day to day basis are things I've learned from experience, or informal mentorship from other engineers, or reading blog posts on programming practices and then applying those things and seeing what works and what doesn't.

But to an economist none of this counts. A 24 year old that just started their first job after getting a masters degree in CS is considered objectively more skilled than someone with an undergrad degree and 10 years of experience.

View on HN

To be fair, technical skills training in the UK is currently mostly delivered through apprenticeships. The model is 80% "on the job", 20% "off the job" training. So, in theory at least, they should deliver the kind of experience and informal mentorship you're talking about, alongside classroom based training (which is supposed to cover fundamentals, theory, etc.).

In practice, how well this works depends on how effectively employer and training provider coordinate, and how committed the employer is to delivering on the mentorship part.

Economists have a habit of abusing data. It's seen as preferable to simplify the system enough to test a hypothesis than to acknowledge that the system is too complex to analyze. A little too much physics influence and not enough engineering.

I would think that software engineering is the exception that proves the rule: people with domain knowledge are highly motivated to share what they know, ask questions, consolidate knowledge, and refine processes using the Internet.

Working in another field (public services might be a good example) it’s often not possible to test out hypothetical solutions, or find relevant expertise, or to even discover that whole areas of knowledge actually exist. In that context, relevant qualifications have a little more weight.

You can go onto youtube and find dozens if not hundreds of people wanting to share their expertise with the world on every subject you could possibly imagine. "Qualifications" are just the result of a lobbying effort from those already in the industry to restrict supply in order to increase the rates they can charge.

> I would think that software engineering is the exception that proves the rule: people with domain knowledge are highly motivated to share what they know, ask questions, consolidate knowledge, and refine processes using the Internet.

Not my experience they don't want these people on the Netherlands not with my skin colour I guess.

For me it's about being given dedicated time and space to actually upskill - sure in house training is (the most?) important, but what about developing new skills that no one in your company already has? Reading blog posts is all well and good as a software engineer but for many roles this is not an option as there might not be high quality content publicly available online.

That's a very long-winded way to express "no u rong"!

very much this. i am applying for a workvisa, and they ask me for my degree (which i don't have) because it counts more than the decade+ of work experience running my own business.

The article is talking more about blue collar work like warehouse workers and lorry (truck) drivers.

This isn't really true. The article talks about apprenticeships. While traditionally apprenticeships in the UK were mostly for blue collar work, these days you can do apprenticeships in almost anything: software engineering, law, medicine, management, etc.

The full list is here: https://www.instituteforapprenticeships.org/apprenticeship-s...?

Top 3 on the list: Space systems engineer, accounting finance manager, robotic systems engineer

Reply on news.ycombinator.com