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Comment by rahimnathwani | Hacker News Reader

I opened a couple of Ghibli movies on the HBO Max app just now, and the only audio and subtitle options were English.

I think HBO Max is weird in that you have to pick the options before you start the movie. I found I couldn't change languages from the audio track or subtitles options while the movie was playing. But I can 100% confirm that I watched all of the movies on HBO Max in Japanese audio with English subtitles. AppleTV 4K.

Thanks for the tip!

https://i.imgur.com/nuRLkcH.png

The only way I can find to switch the audio track is by clicking the word 'English' on the description page (screenshot above), before hitting 'play'. This is really confusing because:

1. There's an option to change the language track once you're playing the movie, but it doesn't show the other option.

2. When you click that button, there's a helpful notification saying you can choose language in 'settings' (which isn't the case!).

3. The icon next to where it says 'ENGLISH' looks like a speech bubble, which to me indicates 'subtitles'.

4. I have to click the word 'ENGLISH' to switch to Japanese!

Ah yes, I remember doing this dance at the beginning of January. As you've discovered, there are about two dozen UX violations with this procedure. Thankfully, I only had to do this once; all the rest of the films played in Japanese by default from then on.

Why is it a problem?

The original versions of the films have Japanese audio, and you're missing out on that if you watch them in english.

Also, at least on the Disney blu-ray releases, there were some notable differences between the English dub and the English subtitles. The most glaring one I ever saw was in Porco Rosso when Curtis says he's from Alabama in the subtitles but from Texas in the dub. The Japanese voice acting is also usually way superior, even though they hire quality actors for the dubs.

For example, Gillian Anderson is a great actress but she doesn't do the character of Moro (in Princess Mononoke) justice, especially compared to the Japanese VA (Akihiro Miwa).

See their voices compared at 4:19 https://youtu.be/1X4RWYsDs8A

I think if you watch Pom Poko[1] with the dub, you're watching a completely different movie.

> Prominent scrotums are an integral part of tanuki folklore, and they are shown and referred to throughout the film, and also used frequently in their shape-shifting. This remains unchanged in the DVD release, though the English dub (but not the subtitles) refers to them as "raccoon pouches".

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pom_Poko

> Also, at least on the Disney blu-ray releases, there were some notable differences between the English dub and the English subtitles.

Some or all of them have 2 different English subtitle tracks — "English" and "English for the Hearing Impaired". For reasons I don't understand in the slightest, they sometimes differ. English for the Hearing Impaired is the one that matches the English Dub.

Dubbing imposes constraints on translation, you have to chose words that look alike when lip syncing. Sometimes dubbing is more like a creative translation, different from original text

Neil Gaiman changed Kaya from Ashitaka's romantic partner to younger sister. He also inserted a fart joke into a moment that didn't deserve it.

The dub is above average, but the original with subs is the best way to watch the film.

Mononoke Hime is still in my top 25 films. If you haven't seen it, please treat yourself. I think it's far better than Sen to Chihiro / Spirited Away.

(FWIW, I bought the domain for Miramax's original marketing page and kept it online: http://princess-mononoke.com)

Who is Kaya, and in what part of the movie does Ashitaka have a romantic partner?

Kaya is the girl at the beginning who meets with Ashitaka secretly after he’s been banished from the village, and gives him the necklace as a memento.

Ooh, I never realized that! Thanks.

afaik the English dub literally changes the ending of Kiki's Delivery Service

There are a lot of differences between the English and Japanese audio in Kiki. For instance, there are more silent periods in the original Japanese version, whereas in the (American) English version they almost stereotypically cannot stop talking. So it seems there was some cultural adaptation beyond simple translation.

> There are a lot of difference between the English and Japanese audio in Kiki

Definitely. Jiji (the cat) has a totally different character if you listen to the dub vs the original Japanese. One of the few instances where I prefer the dub... but I think it's just because I watched it that way as a child. This article [1] is convincing me to go back and give the Japanese audio another try.

[1] https://www.otaquest.com/anime-kikis-delivery-service/

Another layer for this—Kiki's Delivery Service was originally a book series. As far as I am aware, only the first was ever translated into English, and it was translated twice. The second time somewhat recently, and should still be easy to find. There are quite a lot of differences between the two, and you can really see how Miyazaki focused the plot of the movie on what he considered the most important aspect. But in the books, Kiki never loses her ability to converse with Jiji (at least not by the end of the first book; I don't know what happens in later books).

Anyway: if you like the movie, I would recommend tracking down the book. Some of the movie's scenes are lifted directly, but (as always) there's scenes I would have loved to see show up in the movie that didn't.

> One of the few instances where I prefer the dub...

Phil really does a great job.

> the English dub literally changes the ending of Kiki's Delivery Service

True, but that is a rare case where the dub is making a gigantic improvement.

Improvements is a relative term when it comes to art and story telling.

> Improvements is a relative term when it comes to art and story telling.

Improvement is a relative term in all contexts by definition.

Complete tangent:

Last year I watched Women on the Verge of a Nervous Breakdown (1988), a fairly amusing Spanish farce (Almodóvar, so, you know). In the movie some of the characters play voice actors dubbing an American movie to Spanish and I wondered, what movie is that?

The movie they were dubbing is Johnny Guitar (1954). Which is how I came to discover a film that's now well in my top 10.

Maybe don't try that for the voice acting scene in "Jesus of Montreal"

This isn't the case - Studio Ghibli's English dubs have always been perfect, with the studio being very careful about their quality, and in some movies such as Spirited Away, there's sometimes even details of the original design that are expressed in the English dub that weren't in the Japanese version, like a side character's name.

They're still a different production than the English, often with different dialogue. They're "equivalent" in terms of production value but they are "different".

I would add though, that if you aren't into subtitled movies the dubs are still perfectly serviceable and I'd still strongly recommend watching them.

Also despite some of the issues with earlier dubs, some of the later ones are good in their own ways. In the case of Howl's Moving Castle, I prefer the dub by a large margin, Billy Crystal was especially good.

one notable aspect is the lack of silence in the English dubs, the originals use it to great effect but the English dubs always tend to have background music inserted in

it doesn't make it unwatchable by any means but the vibe is no longer as impeccable

https://youtu.be/jM6PPxN1xas

This is why.

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