Hacker News Reader

Comment by nxmnxm99 | Hacker News Reader

[flagged]

We've banned this account for repeatedly posting flamebait and ignoring our requests to stop. Please don't create accounts to break HN's rules with.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33267641 (Oct 2022)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30880209 (April 2022)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25349726 (Dec 2020)

I suppose it is counter-culture in a universe where people dismiss it as being hedonism.

And while hedonism may be a side-effect in some situations, even that comes from eschewing the standards of wider society. I'd argue that is the definition of counter-culture.

You would be hard pressed to find many people who would publicly call it “hedonism”, particularly among the cultural elites. Just because there is some niche that disapproves of a culture doesn’t necessarily make that culture a “counter culture”.

From that sequence of initials, none of T, I, nor A not only fail to scream "hedonism" to me, but rather more often the opposite.

The remainder are not inherently more hedonistic than being straight.

The voices may be loud online, but it's definitely not "normal" culture.

My bank decorates rainbow ATMs during pride month. A block away from my house my local council has created a rainbow street crossing. I don’t think it’s possible to get more mainstream than that.

Taping a nail to your jacket doesn’t make you Punk.

No, but if corporations and cultural elites are all taping nails on their jackets, then punk is no longer counter-cultural.

Sounds like gatekeeping to me. I know LGBT culture generally used to be edgy and underground. But widespread mainstream acceptance means that’s not really true anymore.

In other countries it's still kinda "edgy". Yeah - gay pride is allowed and my bank changed its app icon to include rainbow colours. There also are no "LGBT propaganda" laws so gay-friendly pop culture is allowed. (Like movies depicting same sex families)

But at the same time gay marriages and civil unions are both illegal. Adoption for gay couples is illegal too. Even if they are performed abroad. The state still treat gay couples as if they were roommates or something.

The article (and my comments, and I believe the comments I was replying to) are referring to the United States.

Lots of people are still against gay marriage in the USA. In many states it was legalised against the wishes of the majority. And it can be made illegal again. Just like abortions.

The public opinion numbers on this topic have changed drastically over the last two decades. It's an increasingly minority opinion. In 2004 it was 2:1 against same sex marriage. By 2022 it's 6:4 in favor. It's probably outdated to consider opposition to same sex marriage a majority opinion in much of the US.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/11/15/about-six-i...

In some states that's not a minority opinion. And the court decision also was kinda flimsy - 5:4 instead of 8:1 or something like that. That 5:4 can become 4:5 in the future. And just like abortions - gay marriage can become illegal in some states again.

I provided some data for my assertions. You could at least try to back up your state-level claim.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_opinion_of_same-sex_mar...

In many states support is around ~50%. So opposition to same sex marriage isn't a fringe opinion in a lot of places in the USA. Even in liberal California 33% still don't support it.

It's not fringe yet, but it is extremely well on the way to being a minority opinion. It already is when you consider the national scope.

The states where a majority are still opposed are all states nobody wants to live in for a variety of reasons including poor educational standards and lack of economic development.

There might be some relations between these facts. Maybe not. But it is interesting, isn't it? That those are the places where these opinions stick around the longest?

Sure, but that's a very broad "queer is cool" rather than the more specific ENM, hedonism, etc.

It literally has corporate sponsorship by every Fortune 500 company.

Hell most of them won’t even acknowledge Christmas anymore.

I mentioned this in other comments, but the actual edgy counterculture these days is the tradcath types. They have all the funny memes, they make the media angry, Karens despise them – reminds me a lot of the hippies.

In a universe that does not specify LGBTQIA quotas upon hiring, for instance... counterculture nowadays equals not being a minority.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com