Comment by cabyn | Hacker News Reader

Comment by cabyn | Hacker News Reader

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My whole point is that it's really hard to ever classify exploitation as "good". I guess you can spin taking advantage of those in worse situations as good, but profiting (handsomely) off of people with good options doesn't seem morally great. Certainly good for business. But good for humans? This also isn't lifting Kenya out of poverty, this was a short term contract for a few dozen workers. If this signals to other businesses that Kenya is a great place for cheap labor and little regulation, it could very easily be turn bad for many Kenyans.

Are all the sweatshop and slave labor[1] jobs created by Zara good for those children and slaves? You get cheap clothes out of it after all. But is it really helping anyone other than Zara, and their CEO who is worth ..checks notes... 50+ billion dollars?

Companies could help a lot more by increasing labor standards, helping those in need, paying above a living day to day wage, etc. The would still have a few billion left in the bank I believe...

[1]https://www.forbes.com/sites/andersonantunes/2011/08/17/zara...

What is your definition of exploitation?

>Agents, the most junior data labelers who made up the majority of the three teams, were paid a basic salary of 21,000 Kenyan shillings ($170) per month

Based on my quick and dirty googling, it looks like this is an above average salary for Nairobi.

>Are all the sweatshop and slave labor[1] jobs created by Zara good for those children and slaves? You get cheap clothes out of it after all. But is it really helping anyone other than Zara, and their CEO who is worth ..checks notes... 50+ billion dollars?

You haven't established a connection between OpenAI and slave labour. So this is irrelevant and detracts from your point by costing you credibility.

> If this signals to other businesses that Kenya is a great place for cheap labor and little regulation, it could very easily be turn bad for many Kenyans.

That's for Kenyans to decide.

> My whole point is that it's really hard to ever classify exploitation as "good".

Well, you could ask people from Kenya what they think about this stuff, instead of speaking on their behalf.

I believe someone from there even commented on this, in the thread.

Yeah, like if you removed chatgpt from the equation what would change? A couple hundred-thousand moderators would not have an above-average hourly wage and would instead need to find another international company or a domestic company to hire them who are all abusing the lack of unions and low wages.

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