Rubbish. For the backend, Apollo Server absolutely can be beat by tools that don't require you to write any code:
https://supabase.com/blog/pg-graphql
https://supabase.com/blog/pg-graphql
Anyway, these are all tools to generate a backend based on your database which might work for simple situations but breaks down for more complicated ones. I also don't want to give my backend away to Hasura or Supabase either.
No. I have not been spamming the same comment. I have made several related comments, which I'm free to do just as anyone else is.
Now, YOU'RE free not to use Hasura Cloud (a fine cloud-managed product by a company I work for) or Supabase (a fine cloud-managed product by a company I don't work for). You're also free to use Hasura CE (a self-hosted OSS Docker image), Supabase (another self-hosted OSS Docker image), or Postgraphile (another self-hosted OSS Docker image) if you don't want Hasura or Supabase to host your application. You're even free to believe these tools work only for simple situations but break down for more complicated ones. The thing is, other people are equally free to make other judgments.
For the record I have used Hasura before, both cloud and self-hosted versions. At the time Hasura didn't have serverless functions so it was very difficult to do anything custom even with workarounds. Now it seems Hasura has serverless functions now but now I feel that I shouldn't need to tie my backend and code to a database product lest anything happen to said product, lock-in sucks. That they are OSS or self-hosted does not make them any less susceptible to lock-in. I could also use, for example, Vue, also an OSS product, but if something happens to the primary contributor and no one else wants to maintain it, now I either have to deal with bugs slowly creeping in over time or rewrite my frontend.
So, no thanks, I'd rather keep my own backend and not use a BaaS product.
I see no good reason to accept that proposition. Moreover, I'm not recommending Hasura in this thread (see below). That would be odd, given that I have also said good things about competing products (Potgraphile and Supabase).
> Your comments are also near copy-pastes of each other
I made 4 comments originally:
1. rejecting the claim that Apollo is "_the_" GraphQL company: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34007957
2. rejecting the claim that Apollo client is the only one to use: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34008121
3. answering the question of what to use on the backend besides Apollo: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34018101
4. rejecting the claim that Apollo can't "be beat" on the backend: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34018095
Numbers 3 and 4 are similar but not the same, given their contexts.
For the record, Hasura has never had serverless functions. It never had them before and it still doesn't have them now. We view that as a product decision, but you're free to view it however you like. As for your other reasons for not wanting to use Hasura, you're free to have them just as others are free to reject them. My objective has never been to persuade people to use Hasura. Use whatever you want. My objective was counter claims that I believe are untrue.
It's basic decency on Hacker News or elsewhere. Feel free to accept it or not but know that others will think less of your comments' veracity and trustworthiness by not doing so.
> * Moreover, I'm not recommending Hasura in this thread (see below). That would be odd, given that I have also said good things about competing products (Potgraphile and Supabase).*
Even if you recommend other products, merely linking to it in a list while not disclosing you work there is distasteful.
> I made 4 comments originally:
Regardless of what the claims you were responding to were, your comments themselves for 3 and 4 are copy pasted in content. That is what someone means when they say one's comments are copy-pastes, or said another way, spam. Out of 4 comments, if 50% of them are the same, that's pretty spammy to me.
> For the record, Hasura has never had serverless functions. It never had them before and it still doesn't have them now.
That's funny, I just googled it now and it does seem to have support for them, at least a page that says so. If that's not really using serverless functions (while literally being titled "Using serverless functions") then perhaps they should change the title and clarify the content [0]. I also don't mean that Hasura should have serverless functions itself, like AWS Lambda, I meant that there was not a good way to trigger database events and if you wanted to write custom logic, the recommended way was running a whole other server, which at that point, I'll just write my own backend myself [1].
All this leads me to believe you're shilling for Hasura, don't actually work there, or some combination of both.
[0] https://hasura.io/docs/latest/event-triggers/serverless/
That documentation page says that you can use serverless functions with Hasura, which is true. Hasura custom events call a web-hook, which can be and often is implemented with a serverless function, thought it need not be.
> I also don't mean that Hasura should have serverless functions itself, like AWS Lambda
Thank you for clarifying.
> your comments themselves for 3 and 4 are copy pasted in content
No. I typed out comments 3 and 4 independently "long hand." No copy/paste was involved, save for copying the URLs over.
As for the rest...let's just score that as "a difference of opinion" and call it a day, shall we?
>> I see no good reason to accept that proposition.
You should absolutely disclose that you work for Hasura when talking about Hasura. Like the other commenter mentioned, this is basic decency on this medium. Failure to do so will reflect very poorly on you and your employer here.
What I have done is present not matters of judgment, but matters of fact.
Fact: Apollo is not _the_ GraphQL company.
Fact: Apollo isn't the only one with a GraphQL client library
Fact: Apollo isn't the only path to creating a GraphQL server
As matters of fact, these are either true or false, but readers are free to evaluate which they are on their own. They shouldn't trust me, because I'm a stranger on the Internet. But then again so are you and so are most or all people here.
You say that if I don't disclose who I work for people will trust me less. That's silly, because people here shouldn't trust me at all, nor should they trust you, or anyone else, for the reasons I just gave.
In short: don't accept without careful scrutiny anything you read on the Internet, no matter who says it.
> Have I tried to persuade people to use Hasura? No.
> Have I tried to persuade people that it's good or better than the competition? No.
> For the back-end, Apollo Server absolutely can be beat by tools that don't require you to write any code:
> https://supabase.com/blog/pg-graphql
> https://www.graphile.org/postgraphile/
The careful reader will note that I presented three alternatives, with the one provided by my company last. Moreover, what I wrote is in fact a matter of fact. If you wish to have a GraphQL server without having to write server code to do it, as fine a product as Apollo is you cannot use Apollo to do it because that's not what Apollo does.