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Comment by syntheweave | Hacker News Reader

Manhwa have definitely had more of a strict formula to them than most other contemporary comics, at least the ones I've viewed. Most of the stories seem to be copy-pastes of a "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy, with characterizations falling along class and gender stereotypes. Illustrations are likewise industrial in nature, using the same posable doll figures to churn out basic talking head + fighting panels. I can't recall one that did good establishing shots or worked the vertical layout for interesting composition.

That said, I still read the stuff on occasion. It's still comics, and not far in the adherence to formula.

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Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west?

Manga and anime is very diverse, and yet, only the "shounen" style seems to represented, and that's not even the full spectrum of what shounen has to offer. I don't know much about manhwa, maybe there is more depth to what we are served, or maybe it is just that they just focused on what is commercially successful.

> Isn't the "weak guy becomes tough guy" power fantasy make the majority of the manga market, at least in the west?

Shōnen is probably the bigger market, but it’s worth noting that the key to the “style” is that it’s the term for the target market: young boys. There is usually a power accumulation fantasy, but more accurately these are typically coming-of-age stories.

So:

Shōnen: Young Boys

Shōjo: Young Girls

Seinen: Young Men

Josei: Ladies (there is also a separate category for “Young Ladies”)

As you can see, these are less genre terms and more demographic terms.

Additionally in manhuas, some non so usual topice are overreepresented, like a _lot_ of shonnen manhuas about business character success/CEO kind of stuff.

That’s normal for Korea - Kdramas do it all the time too. Not so much in the West.

> Not so much in the West.

There are plenty of soap operas that feature similar plot lines.

They’re different kinds of power fantasies. The one in webtoons is called “naroukei” in Japan, has more self identification and a dark brooding incel hero, and implies you’ll get a girlfriend by being really good at video games. Most popular Japanese example is SAO, although the author of that has lightened up a lot and is woke now. (The fantasy novel “isekai” variant has a strange tendency to have the MC buy sex slaves and the author to explain why it’s fine actually.)

Jump comics are the best selling manga in the US, but the brand basically works by having a few big magic power based series (Demon Slayer etc) that draw you in and then a lot of other ones in different genres (Spy X Family is a family comedy). Also, while none of the editor staff are or ever have been women, these are actually appealing to girls.

Rather than a single self-identification MC, Jump’s magic battle shounens tend to have very large ensemble casts who simultaneously have unique superpowers and are in some kind of corporate org chart power ranking. It’s unclear how they figure out that the guy who can turn into lava on Thursdays is rank #5 and the guy whose shoulders are drums and when he bangs the drums your head explodes is #28.

Maybe that's because the distributor thinks other genre of manga is so fringed that cannot generate enough revenue to justify the translation?

That is increasingly less the case, thankfully. These things do take time though. An interesting parallel is the French market for translated manga, which has a much higher diversity of series in non-shounen demographics available. Hard to know how much of that is due to the French actually being more interested in these demographics, and how much is American publishers believing that manga targeted at other demographics is likely to be less successful and hence mostly going with safe bets.

I dunno, it might be your choices. I have seen way more diverse range of manghwa genres then, say, comic. By diverse, I mean there was comedy, romance, historical drama, workplace dramas, stuff seemingly aimed at stay at home women, you name it.

The stuff you name is stuff aimed at young men or boys. But there is more to it then just that.

And quite often, there's a tower... there is some kind of obsession with a tower which escapes me, but I can understand its usage, it's a convenient way of shifting scenes into something completely new, instead of having to maintain continuity

You have only seen a small part of manhwa and you are trying to define what manhwa is. Way to go, sir. Keep doing it. You may at the end gain a small followers

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