Hacker News Reader

For a month now, I've been getting up at 5am every day to go cruising around my empty city on a skateboard, as a complete noob. It's changed my life substantially for the better. I've been very interested to figure out where I found this implausible level of... motivation? self-discipline? I'm not the sort of person to expect such from myself. Where did this unexpected success come from, and how can I attempt to continue it -- what does its forward extrapolation look like?

Your comment resonates with me as very plausible. All the places I skate, for practical reasons, happened to be nature-rich parks that are the most aesthetic and pleasant places to be around. The sort of places that I'd lounge all day in, if I had an *excuse* to, if it made any sense to sit around all day on a park bench in the autumn chill. The sort of places my phone is stuffed with random photos I take of. (God-rays through the tree leaves! Cool squirrel!) Maybe I shouldn't discount these minor psychological factors, this atavistic familiarity with nature? Maybe it does have an outsized influence on my actions. I wonder.

I've been waiting for the end of a long, wet winter to go and explore some new places on online skates - been working on various braking and slalom techniques indoors to learn the skills needed to do outdoors more safely (for myself and others).

Need to get one of those stabilising selfie sticks for recording the adventures - holding a phone by hand results in a choppy nausea inducing clip.

It's amazing how much fulfilment I get from riding around natural spaces on an electric unicycle (also works for bikes or whatever but that's what I use now), taking the occasional picture of things I find interesting. I sometimes wonder if it taps into hunter instincts and exercises normally unused parts of my subconscious brain.

This is known in the running community as the MAF method or Zone 2 training and it is key to sustaining an injury minimizing habit of running.

Think about it this way, do you enjoy a nice long walk? Most people do. You also don't have to mentally prepare yourself to go on a walk. Do you enjoy a nice long sprint? Probably not. If you tried to do it every day you would have to mentally prepare yourself for the upcoming suck. That's a huge hurdle to making it a habit.

So why not try to find a sweet spot in between a walk and a sprint? Just build up speed gradually from a walk. Once you have days where you have to psyche yourself up to go for a run, you know you are going too hard. Going for a walk and going for an easy run should not be any different for you mentally, although you might have to take a shower after a run.

Hope anyone who has struggled with running in the past is able to regain confidence with this mindset

> I've found that I always pushed myself way too hard while running. The goal is not to be fast or have the best time.

This was a key point for me. Like many, I started with Couch to 5K. During my run intervals, I ran too fast. Had to make up for that 2 minutes of walking.

Eventually, after much reading and trial and error, I finally figured out how to run and how to program running. My standard is to keep my 1 mile time right at 7 minutes. I test it once a month. If it is creeping up, I’ll add in more running/cardio. Otherwise, I keep everything the same.

It took a lot of months of “slow” 11 and 12 minute miles to build up my body to be ready to start doing the tempo runs and speed work. I think too many new runners start right off with tempo and speed work because they “gotta feel the burn”, and they get embarrassed being passed. There were times I was going to quit running because I’m maintaining a 12 minute pace and people walking their dogs were passing me.

I don’t remember where I heard this (or read it), but depending on when you start your fitness journey, remember you spent YEARS getting yourself to where you were. You’re not going to turn it all around in months much less days.

I’ve exercised probably 90% of days for the last ten years. Days when I don’t are just rest days or travel days. To be honest, I think it’s best just to make it a habit like brushing your teeth. Working out is just what you do, and it’s a weird day if you don’t. Being highly motivated is kind of fleeting and just boring routine is more important.

Yep 100% agreed.

I worked out in the morning because "It's Monday, and Monday is a weekday, so that's why" is far more sustainable in the long term. Sometimes less thinking is better.

This said, for many people with jobs/kids/other commitments, regular workout is more of an exercise in scheduling than willpower. For that, the only advice I could offer is to use the mornings, and be done before anyone else in the house realises.

> Also, how your body feels after a run, is one of the best motivators to do it again.

Not everyone feels like this. I hate running, and hate the way my body feels afterwards. I just want to go to bed or sit down and do absolutely nothing. It wrecks my productivity for hours. I tried to get into running a few times because of the supposed "high" that you eventually start to feel. Never once felt it, even after several months of forcing myself to do daily runs.

Maybe the problem is that your are pushing yourself too hard. I think you will feel significantly less fatigued if you cut the intensity of your running workouts in half. From here you can work on slowly increasing your speed and endurance.

I did all that. When I started I could not run more than maybe a hundred yards. So I would run a little, walk a lot, run a little more, and slowly the ratio of running to walking changed and I could run a few miles without stopping to walk. I still felt just terrible and exhausted at the end of it. I never felt a high, or any other "good" feeling from it.

> I still felt just terrible and exhausted at the end of it.

If you put in half as much effort in those times, do you think you would've felt the same?

You need a significant base level of fitness and a long enough run at a good pace to feel a runners high. However, it’s not limited to running cycling, swimming, and rowing can provide the same rush.

Anyway if your feeling exhausted after a daily run then slow down, it takes more than one day to recover from heavy exercise so daily runs should stay casual.

I've never gotten a "runner's high" from running. After decades of not experiencing it, I started doing circuit workouts in my basement due to covid. Strangely enough, finally experienced the "high" from circuit/HIIT workouts that combined weights & bodyweight movement. A pleasant surprise.

I recently started experiencing this for the first time, earlier I believed the same you do. It’s funny reading the thread here because it echoes a lot of my experiences - what made the difference was seeing it as “I’m going for a walk but will run any parts where I feel like it”. Now I’m not too tired afterwards and while I’m outside I’m able to think and observe nature around me. I tend to go around my lunch break, and have also had quite some work problems dissolving while I was out (a bit like how you sometimes come up with solutions under the shower). That’s another thing that helps me see this as useful time rather than a chore.

Genuinely curious, why would you force yourself into daily run for months when you feel bad after it? I mean, there are many sports, chances are one of them you will like. So why forcing yourself into obe you hate?

I made this same point in another response.

To answer your question, I was sedentary, not particularly overweight but I knew it was unhealthy, and I wanted to do something to get in better shape. I knew some people who were into running and they talked about how great it made them feel. I tried it, kept at it for a while despite what a miserable an experience it was, in the hope that there would be a "breakthrough" at some point and I would start enjoying it.

I now do weightlifting, and it's something I've been able to stick with for a few years. I don't "love" doing it but it's tolerable.

Dunno if you are still interested in hearing what helped others, I suppose not everybody has to like running, but I know that I learned to like both seimming and running at some point when before it was dreadful.

* It helped me to learn a lot about running form, which would make going for a run interesting because there are so many things to observe about one‘s body and form while doing it. Like honing a difficult skill. Same for swimming.

* Finding an intellectual interest in learning about running helped me as well. If I want to do something for hours, I better be really interested in it… (e.g. Daniel Lieberman‘s work / Born to Run / watching races / learning about how athletes today can run so much faster than before, ultra running,…)

* Running without shoes sometimes is a much richer sensory experience and not boring at all.

* I still way overestimated what a proper pace would be for me, and only started slowing down and enjoying running more recently. I know the feeling of feeling shredded the next day, but that means the workout was too hard. It took me over a year to go from a pandemic/work induced low-point to enjoying 5k runs regularly, and I underestimated how slow and steady the change would be. Can‘t emphasize enough how easy the easy runs should be. I can now enjoy 5k at a slow pace even though I could run 20k at a faster pace if I wanted to on any day.

* Finally, I think running is better with friends. [cf. Daniel Lieberman‘s work]

No I've pretty much abandonded the idea that I will ever enjoy running. I've given it more than a fair shake, and have found other ways to stay active.

I don't hate distance running or jogging in the slightest. Despite the fact that it works against all my natural talents, and would be a great way to injure myself if I did it. So I don't.

Sprinter's build is a real thing. If I ever run more than 200 meters at a stretch, I'm probably dodging bullets.

Haha! My neighbor was in the infantry in the Army, and he’s a smoker. Deployed 3 times - twice to Afghanistan and once to Iraq. According to him he’s been smoking since he was 18 and doesn’t plan on quitting (to each their own). I asked him once if smoking affected his running in the infantry. He told me what his sergeant told him - when you’re getting shot at, your cardio will be there.

I have switched from thinking "what should I do" to "what nice thing can I do for future me".

It's not an instant fix, but it's a definite uptick in execution. For me. Your mileage may vary.

It's a great change of perspective, beautifully put. Very motivating.

For me, running was a chore. I had to really make my self go running. My body simply did not want to run. But after a year of 3x a week, a funny thing happened. My body started wanting to go running. I'd look forward to it.

I've been lifting for 20 years now. My body still hates it. Oh well :-/ what can you do.

P.S. I never time the runs, I never push it. I just run and don't worry about it. If someone passes me running faster, I yell at them for cheating :-)

> I never time the runs

I found running to be more enjoyable once I stopped using run-tracking apps like Strava.

Now I just use my phone's built-in pedometer. A run is just a way to help me hit 10k+ steps per day. During my runs I can be spontaneous without feeling like I'm going to ruin my Strava pace, and running isn't this overt start -> finish ordeal anymore.

I did the step thing for a while. and the heart rate monitor thing. Finally got bored with that and just go running :-)

P.S. after using the heart rate monitor for a while, you wind up with a pretty good feel for what it is without looking.

Great story. I have a similar one with swimming. When I started swimming laps, I'd always come at it hard, and I'd sometimes panic, lose my breathing, and feel like I was going to drown, and have to stop completely. And it was terrifying.

Eventually I learned to a) slow down at the start, and b) to recognize when I was inching toward the redline, and slow down while still swimming to avoid the panic stop. I felt, and still feel, that there was an important life lesson there: to be attuned to yourself, to make conscious decisions about your behavior based on that awareness, optimize for 'harmony', or 'least disruption'. There are some psychological things going on, too, like shame, guilt, etc that seem really silly now but felt real and were pushing me toward the wrong conclusions!

> how your body feels after a run, is one of the best motivators to do it again

Last summer I stupidly went hard on one or two of the hot AF days (30C) and went 5-6 miles or so then got home feeling like I’d had the wind kicked out of me.

Needless to say, for the next few weeks my body would feel… scared(?) to go for a run and I had to skip more than a few just from the feeling of apprehension. Now I try to run slow and get home feeling moderately exerted and I actually look forward to my runs.

In fact, if I run in the morning, I get the blues after work because I don’t have a run to go on anymore!

Agreed. I'm not motivated by punishment, especially arbitrary and voluntary punishment. And I'd have to bet $1000 per workout to even feel the financial pain, and at that point, it would also be directly conflicting with my financial goals. The whole made up agreement seems like it would take a lot of willpower for me to keep.

What motivates me to exercise is to focus on the tangible benefits I get from exercise. The main one: I feel great after a good workout. I also love to use running and swimming as excuses to explore new places, which gives me another immediate tangible benefit.

One of the best runs of my life was during pandemic lockdowns in Spain when we were finally allowed to leave the house after 3 months, but only as long as we were exercising. The easiest excuse for me to get a change of scenery was to run a 15k (I had been running 5ks in circles on my roof, so I was in shape). I have never enjoyed a long run so much.

It helps if you have a nice park to run through. I think this is why I've always had an easier time consistently doing cardio than someone who might only do cardio on a stationary bike or treadmill. My friends don't believe me when I tell them I actually enjoy running. Running through nature can be a immersive and genuinely pleasurable experience. If you pay close attention it's never boring, there are always new things to notice on the trail, plus the endorphin high after a session is a reward in itself.

Like most difficult things, the more you do it the easier it is to keep doing it

Also, you don't need to run continuously. It's perfectly fine to run for a couple minutes and then walk a bit. I think people's definitions of exercise are often too strict, or constrained.

Another way to get into running is to start by just going for a brisk walk and run a little bit when you feel like it. That's how I got into trail running. I was going for long hikes, and at some point I started jogging short sections (maybe only 30 seconds) when I was feeling good. By doing this I could limit the total amount of running I was doing while still getting a good workout in.

> Also, how your body feels after a run, is one of the best motivators to do it again.

This is the only thing that works for me.

No matter what I do, I can't make myself enjoy the actual run. I failed Couch to 5K multiple times. During my last attempt, I got stuck on week 5 and--frustrated with my lack of progress--forced myself to the top of the hill I was struggling with. I almost passed out, but I felt incredible for the rest of the day.

That did it. Now I'm out there first thing every morning because I crave that feeling, and the more I punish myself during the better I feel after.

I'd have to find the book. But there was research that showed that long-term motivating factors like being healthy, weight loss etc. were not as effective as short-term motivating factors like "I like how I feel after I run/workout/..." or It is beautiful to get outside, etc.

Basically, focusing on what is good about it now rather than what will be good later is better at building the habit.

“Action comes before motivation” is something I constantly tell myself. On occasion I remember this and I actually do the thing.

I like the idea of reframing your goal from "I will run 5 times per week" to "I will be a person that runs often."

This works for me because if I miss one day of running then I've failed my goal immediately, whereas missing a few runs won't break the second goal and lets me make it up. This works for other goals as well.

It sounds like you are relatively new to running. Have you had any problems with your knees? I have friends that want to start jogging but are hesitant to start. I've suggested walking instead.

As someone else has said: you can always start by mixing walking with jogging. The most important part is to start moving.

As for myself: I am not really new to running. However, since moving places I didnt run anymore because my only real motivation were the friends I did my runs with. I did other team sports as replacement (which I liked a lot). However, due to covid lockdowns I basically stopped all sports and gained weight. So, something had to give. I tried running (alone!) and thankfully it now works for me (as I advertised ;)). I started with a pace that was basically not really faster than people "walking". Since I have so much fun running right now, I actually have to watch out not to overdo it. I notice my knees a little but I don't really think they are the weakest part actually (losing more weight would help a lot wrt not overexerting the knees). As other posters have said: Going slowly (really slowly! If it feels like you're pushing yourself, it might be better to walk then.) is also the best thing one can do wrt avoiding injuries etc. So I can't really give a general recommendation except trying it out and see how your body feels. I think one can find out a lot by themselves simply by listening to the signals of the body.

Running is bad for your knees is a common misconception. Just gotta ease in. I’ve been running for years and have had no knee issues. I know many people with tens of thousands of miles on their legs (approaching 6 figures in some cases) and their knees are fine