Resource 1 by me: https://vladh.net/alternatives-to-wage-labour
Resource 2 by Yanis Varoufakis: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/49098225-another-now
More resources: https://vladh.net/wage-labour-resources
Resource 1 by me: https://vladh.net/alternatives-to-wage-labour
Resource 2 by Yanis Varoufakis: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/49098225-another-now
More resources: https://vladh.net/wage-labour-resources
First, do you know what Soviet stands for? The relevant meaning of the word in Russian is "council", and it refers to "worker councils", "soldier councils", etc. that made the revolution happen (the Petrograd Soviet, or council, in St Petersburg was the main alternative power structure to Provisional Government that took over from the czar), that were supposed to "democratically" run things like factories, and send delegates to higher levels to democratically run things there. Somehow, this all ended up a dictatorship, as it did pretty much every time something like this has been tried.
Then, economically, co-ops are perfectly legal in the West. There are some successful ones, like REI. I shop at REI a lot, and I really don't give a damn if employers are wage laborers or co-op members - I doubt most people do. If anything, some people might prefer co-ops because they would give them the same warm fuzzy feeling as green-washed products do, so a co-op would start out with a competitive advantage at least among the well-off liberals. Why not go build a coop to replace your local restaurant or a laundromat; or Exxon, or Google, or whatever? Perhaps because generally, it doesn't work so well? Heck, I don't know how much of a "real" co-op REI is anymore, at this scale.
Maybe you meant “well, if people are so upset by the status quo, why don't they just all quit and form their own co-operatives to make Starcraft 3?”. This is a great point, and a really interesting question. I think we should all encourage these more just ways of organising companies, but I think people really hesitate to do this because it's really drilled into us culturally that the current system is the only way. In particular, we want to be successful, and be seen as successful, and we get a lot more points in that category if we work for a successful corporation such as Meta, compared to forming some ragtag co-operative.
I do think, and hope, that this is starting to change. I admire the fact that sourcehut [0] is basically organised as a co-operative, and for that matter, so is Valve.
As a result, co-ops need to grow differently and often compete differently; you can't afford to pay 50 people right out the gate to build Starcraft 3 to sell in 2 years' time. You need to be making money from day 1, and you can't compete directly with companies that have access to capital or you lose immediately.
There do exist co-ops in the video game industry - Motion Twin, behind Dead Cells, is one.
It's the intrinsic structure of being owned by the workers that makes co-operatives less financially attractive to outside investors. My previous comment about why: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11166080
Co-operatives also have to compete in the marketplace (compete in both the costs & revenue) with other companies that are not co-ops. This financial pressure from other global economic actors is what causes co-ops like Mondragon to outsource labor to subcontractors or workforce in other countries who are not true members of the co-op. Mondragon appliances, etc still have to compete in sales with everyone else.
If so, the question that remains is a relatively open one. Let's say that, for the sake of argument, we reached the conclusion that organising companies as co-operatives would bring considerable social benefits to the majority of people compared to the current way or organising work. If this were true, what would have to be changed so as to make them a reasonable option? Perhaps our values of prioritising economic values over social value? Perhaps regulations on shareholders?
Yanis Varoufakis proposes a system that answers this question in Another Now [0], but I'm also curious to hear other answers.
[0]: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/49098225-another-now
So let's open a couple of Ask HN/Pool HN: Are you an investor? Did you invest in a coop-like startup? Would you invest in a coop-like startup? Under which conditions?
You can always start a co-op which makes a WoW clone. Nothing stops people from that. The fact that it's practically never done says a lot about real-life applicability of co-ops.
I think it proves that co-ops are just worse at complex tasks. A company requires just one dedicated and driven individual (the founder), and the rest of people can be hired and just do tasks assigned to them. Whereas, in a coop, the decision-making process is much harder, and just doesn't work as well for complex organizations. And, game devving (like many other complex tasks) is so hard and fraught with perils, that you don't want to throw in additional complications if you don't have to.
Worker collectives, because they are uncommon, and do not operate under well-known legal framework, face significant obstacles in, for example, getting loans.
This seems to be very much in contrast with the linked article. There are significant legal obstacles as well as much resistance in the form of illegal violence.
That is viable in some cases.
The underlying issue is that distribution of corporate growth is relegated to a small percentage of all organizations out there. To put it simply, a small percentage of companies above a certain size grow quickly while the rest are slowly dying. As a result, not only are the distribution of outsized monetary rewards highly biased in favor of a small percentage of companies, but the fight to maintain position once that period of growth is over is intense. Modern companies growth fast, survive for a time, and then go away.
This leads to an unfortunate dynamic where any competitive advantage that leads to either growth or survival matters. If a top-down managerial structure where rewards inside of the company are distributed to a small layer of top level managers and owners provides even a slight economic advantage over an employee-owned structure, the former is going to win out.
This may sound unfair, and it likely is, but the question becomes: if I am a worker at 'traditional corp.' with a 100K salary and a funded 401K, will I do better than if I was a worker at 'employee-owned corp.' with the same salary but an ownership share? The deciding point being that traditional corp. has a 20% chance of going away over the next ten years while employee-owned corp. has a 20%+ chance of going away over the same period of time.
This is hard to say. I think there are two competing trends: 1. Co-operative ownership is becoming more prevalent. This is particularly true in situations where entrepreneurial bricolage (making do with what you have on hand) is a factor. 2. However, there aren't that many examples of legitimate co-operative ownership in larger corporations. They do exist, but the sample size is small.
As far as I'm aware, employee co-ownership is more associated with the concept of 'psychological ownership', where the organization tries to make an employee feel like they own a portion of the company. This can come from actual ownership via RSUs or stock options, or through other factors, such as company culture. The idea here being that psychological ownership increases employee effectiveness.
The issue is that 1. top management generally has more influence than owners and 2. it's not always (or usually) in the best interest of the employee to have more than a small percentage of their net worth tied up in their employer.
Think about it this way. In a (greatly simplified model of) democracy, voters essentially "own" the government. However, the politicians they elect as well as an employed bureaucracy are the ones generally calling the shots. Democracy works because it provides a floor where, if performance falls to a certain point, the top management layer is replaced by a different set of managers.
However, corporations are not governments. Governments (especially local governments) - and bureaucracies - last a very long time, to the extent that they generally survive well after whatever state they were originally part-of goes away. In other words, they're robust. You can have a bad set of elected, or unelected, officials and regardless of what happens, odds are that the entity they represent will still be around decades if not centuries later.
Corporations are the opposite. The failure rate is sizable. Like I wrote in my previous post, a small number of larger companies are adding economic value, while the rest are in the process of fading away. The question here is whether a co-operative model provides enough of a benefit beyond the standard corporate ownership structure to provide some benefit to either of these phases.
My guess is that the answer is no for the growth phase and, depending on the organization/industry, maybe or a slight yes for the later maintenance phase. That said, the sample size of employee owned co-operatives in growth-oriented industries is so small that I don't know if the data exists to take a shot at answering either question.