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Comment by mgaunard | Hacker News Reader

I don't understand, 1,700 per year is nothing.

You'd need to spend twice that amount just to acquire decent coffee equipment. Then waste a huge amount of time teaching yourself how to source good beans, make good coffee, not mentioning the time needed to execute and clean up even when you have achieved mastery.

No, buying from a coffee shop with trained baristas making coffee all day is a much better deal, unless you're in need of a new hobby.

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This comment gives me "how much could a banana cost" vibes.

You can out-brew Starbucks with about $50 of "equipment": $20 Mr. Coffee machine, a pack of 100 paper filters for $5, and a $20 electric grinder. Skip teaching yourself how to source good beans and just buy some fresh, local whole beans at your grocery store. Probably a medium roast.

Pike Place really is not a high bar. (I doubt I'm even two degrees away from anyone who has a $3,400 coffee setup.)

Ignorance is bliss, I guess.

A good grinder alone is 675 dollars.

A Baratza Encore burr grinder retails new for $170, but you can get one in great shape on eBay for $50-70: https://www.ebay.com/itm/325267513385

I can't even fathom what you'd get for $675. What does it do?

https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/325267513385?item=32526751...

Heh, looks like this link started a bidding war

If you want to make espresso the type of grinder is important for the quality of the coffee. More important than the espresso machine. You want a disc grinder, and they are more expensive than cone grinders.

For filter / french press / aeropress it doesn't matter as much and you can use any cheap grinder.

Your prices are starting to make more sense. Wild stab here, but I don't think most people read "decent coffee equipment" and thought, "espresso machine at a minimum"

I agree with you, and I'd like to add that parents prices are high even for espresso machines. You can get a decent espresso machine + grinder for under 1000€.

You can look up the Niche Zero.

You gotta be trolling. This is definitely a caricature of some of the worst commenters on hn.

How good do you need to grind to justify $675 to crush your beans?

>No, buying from a coffee shop with trained baristas making coffee all day is a much better deal

Not the OP, but my bar for "good coffee" is pretty low. I think I'm not alone, and for a lot of us the investment is way smaller. In 2017, I spent about $500 for a grinder, kettle, scale, dripper and glass containers. I haven't spent a cent since then on infra, just ongoing expenses for beans (again, not terribly expensive given the bar).

I like an amazing coffee now and then, but the number of places where the $8 coffee is really amazing is vanishingly small, IMO.

I'm skeptical you need all of that to get a cup of coffee you'll like the same amount.

Is there quantitative data out there on the kinds of coffee people like the best? I recall a TED talk [1] which claims (not as its main claim) most people like weak milky coffee despite claiming to like a dark roast - claimed preferences are different from revealed preferences. I don't know if that's true or not, but it'd be interesting to see the data.

Personally, I think my bar for "good coffee" is so low that I'll be satisfied with the shittiest mug of instant coffee with a small amount of any milk.

[1]: https://www.ted.com/talks/malcolm_gladwell_choice_happiness_...

> Personally, I think my bar for "good coffee" is so low that I'll be satisfied with the shittiest mug of instant coffee with a small amount of any milk.

When I wake up and the household hasn’t finished yesterday’s pot I just pour it in a mug, zap it, and I’m fine. Let someone else go to the effort :-)

Coffee has a lot of rituals that have replaced smoking. People rave about Philz coffee in the Bay Area, but if you walk in you can’t just walk straight out with a cup of coffee. No, you must make a bunch of choices (there’s no default nor minimal option) and then wait for them to make it. The entertainment is the point. I like that in a restaurant but can’t be bothered for just a cup of coffee. I’d rather spend my time on talking with the person I’m with, not paying to be entertained.

> Coffee has a lot of rituals

You might appreciate this article: https://www.seriouseats.com/the-case-for-bad-coffee

> Standing at my kitchen counter, I measure out two teaspoons of Maxwell House instant coffee into my favorite mug, pour in 12 ounces of hot water from a tea kettle, and stir for a moment. I look toward the automatic drip maker to my left and feel a pang of sympathy for its cold carafe that once gurgled and steamed each morning with the best coffee money could buy. On top of the refrigerator, my old friend the French press has gathered dust. When I notice a dead housefly decomposing inside it, I wonder what the hell has happened to me.

I really liked that, thanks!

Probably because I hate lines, it always shocks me to see the cars lined up around the block at takeout for my local Starbucks. In person lines are almost as bad. I've skipped coffee in the morning when traveling because I didn't want to stand in a 15 minute line.

Used to do the same and still would if I had a coffee maker. Now I just use a plastic drip cup, filter, and cafe bustelo (nothing against coffee makers, it's just less space/easier imo). Tastes good, affordable, lifts spirits, gives some pep, gets the job done, and helps trigger the morning number 2/three Ss.

Though, one does wonder if the connoisseurs have better experiences with their morning laxatives

There are diminishing returns there, and I'm assuming this was standard drop coffee, not a pour over. Is a Mr Coffee and some generic ground coffee going to be as good? Likely not (but if it's a generic coffee shop, it really is a toss up in my opinion). If you get a $1,500 grinder and then use something like a V60, that's more expensive in equipment than most people care to buy or can taste enough of a difference to make it worth while.

Also, most people don't care about their coffee enough to consider $1,700 "nothing".

An Aeropress costs 30€ and makes better coffee than most coffeeshops. You can learn using an aeropress in 10 min.

Good coffee is typically 30€ per kilo and easily available everywhere in speciality stores. Heck, most supermarkets here even sell acceptable coffee.

You really don't need to spend thousands a year for good coffee.

He was buying coffee every day on campus, not driving to the best coffee shop in town. The priority was convenience and the priority would still be convenience - one button coffee, rather than becoming an expert coffee taster.

> I don't understand, 1,700 per year is nothing.

Welp, good for you for getting the money to roll on in and not be able to understand that most people aren't in that position. Median income, at least in the US, is ~$30k.

$1700 is significant for the majority of folks, not just in the US, but the World. $1700 spent purely on coffee each year is also laughable and/or outrageous to most, when that could cover rent for 1-4 months.

...the hubris on HN lately, regarding high personal income, is too much...

How to get it 99% cheaper:

- https://www.traderjoes.com/home/products/pdp/coconut-cold-br...

- https://www.traderjoes.com/home/products/pdp/050759

Can even upgrade to the French roast.

In the summer, I sometimes like ice coffee. I actually bought a cold brew coffee maker. I still use it for iced tea sometimes but otherwise I just pick up the cold brewed coffee in the supermarket.

In addition, although I'm definitely not a Keurig fan I rather like Nespresso and have been having that rather than dealing with the filling and cleaning of my espresso maker.

I cannot tell if this is a joke.

You can get very good equipment for a lot less, Gaggia Classic + Baratza Encore will set you back around USD 700 new and will last for many years. If you want all in one Barista Express is about 500.

Where do I need to spend that much for coffee equipment?

If you want high end grinder and a dual boiler espresso machine with good temperature stability.

Unless you want to take part in barista competitions you really don't need to spend that much money.

The hint was in the "decent".

The decent espresso machine is more than $3,000. You'll also need to acquire a grinder, usually around $1,000.

I did not think that espresso is standard for high quality coffee. It is just a type of the coffee. You can make ”decent” coffee with regular pressure boiler and $200 grinder.

You don't even need a grinder unless you make espresso IMO. Filter coffee from pre-ground coffee is pretty good (as long as you drink enough coffee so it doesn't go stale).

I agree that if you are able to consume filter coffee quick enough, grinder is optional. Of course, unless you want to be picky with the roast of the coffee.

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