Comment by eatonphil | Hacker News Reader

Comment by eatonphil | Hacker News Reader

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Yes 100%. If you, OP, are already outside of a major tech metro (so not SF, NYC, Seattle, Boston) then even better. Small companies outside of major tech metros are desperate for developers who can code because these companies cannot compete on stock or salary the same way major tech metro companies do. These small companies often even train up smart-looking people who don't know code already just to fill their needs.

Judging solely from your "resume", OP, you are in a very good position.

Try looking around Craigslist too for local companies hiring developers. That's how I got my start ~10 years ago making $70k or so. If you have any code you can share, try emailing the CEO/CTO directly explaining your interest and sharing your resume and code.

And always ignore the exact qualifications listed and apply anyway. You don't know what the candidate pool looks like for a company and listings tend to inflate what they need or can get.

Happy to chat more in email (see my HN profile) since I was in a somewhat similar place as you, OP, years ago.

Anyone, not just OP welcome to message me.

>Try looking around Craigslist too for local companies hiring developers.

Here's the funny thing- My best career years were at jobs I found on Craigslist. They still paid pretty low next to decent traditional job sectors (banking, logistics, etc) that hire devs, but WLB was usually very good. I felt lucky to have worked at a web agency that, while not very reputable, at least didn't work their engineers to the bone at late hours.

Then I tried to "level up" around 2015-16 moving to major corporate listings on LinkedIn, Indeed, and Angel.co for startups etc, and was taken aback at how the jobs market there showed no mercy to me. I was striking out every time.

Falling behind in web tech most likely also had something to do with it, but in any case, it made my plans for a better future more difficult. I was on and off with attempting that side of the market, hence the sporadic nature of my freelance jobs in the late 2010's.

I live in a non-tech MCOL metro area. Is CL still ripe for dev work in 2022? I stopped using it after 2014 but I have noticed back then that listings were starting to dry up.

Other ideas: Would you also suggest consultancies and body shops like Accenture and Deloitte? Or would that be too out of my league? I'm just curious on the "they hire anyone with a degree" stereotype and curious to test how accurate that is.

I will message you later if I have any more questions that might come up.

It's a numbers game. I've worked for startups and Oracle and Linode. I have a somewhat popular blog and somewhat popular Github projects.

It still takes me maybe 50-100 applications before I find the right job every time I go searching.

It's easy to get discouraged but just take breaks when you need to and keep trying. At least, that's what I do!

I've taken some breaks as well. Since COVID I have personally recorded at least 1,000 job applications, 800 in the last year alone, with ~30 interviews. Got burned out last fall, and trying to get back into a rhythm of 5 per day. But I also get a lot of recruiter emails anyway and a lot of choices there too. Sometimes it can get overwhelming.

It’s time to approach your search differently

Learn to build a network inside the companies you want to work for

Start with Sarah Johnston’s advice: https://briefcasecoach.com/

Having worked in HR - you are trapped in the ATS system black hole. Never apply for a job cold. Always have an employee refer you in. You will 3x your chances (from 2% to 6%) with that one decision.

Employment isn’t by companies, it’s by teams.

Get your LinkedIn & Twitter game going.

I’ve been where you are. I made $50k more a year by making the decision to hire a career coach.

You’ve got a lot to offer. Giver yourself a real chance.

Have you tried taking a job at a Contracting firm type place? (Accenture, Revature, TCS) they do hire American on shore contractors, and they hire basically anyone. Go in, do some work for a year or two to at least get a bit of corporate recent work experience, and jump to somewhere better.

I haven't applied to all the ones I know, but my application to Infosys in 2020 was rejected (full stack Java dev). I had assumed these body shops just train you to fill in the gaps. It's been 2 years so I'm gonna give it ago again with similar companies. And test this theory because I was "basically anyone" and they still rejected my application.

Woah, 800 in the last year alone? That's a _ton_ of applications. Are you sending unique cover letters with each one?

It might be better to focus on quality over quantity in this case. Has anyone reviewed your resume and given pointers?

Agreed, this seems like a case for getting external help. Career coach, resume reviewer, practice interviews, mentoring, etc. Stay humble, ask for help!

> It still takes me maybe 50-100 applications before I find the right job every time I go searching.

To get some data points with others' experience, how long does the period of submitting 50–100 applications take? How about time between first contact to hire? (That is, for a given company you've ended up working for, how long between submitting your application to that company and receiving an offer?)

For me, 6-12 months.

Hey OP, have you considered applying for tech jobs in non-tech fields? For example, instead of applying at web agencies & consultancies, applying for openings directly with small to mid size employers in other industries, like ecommerce shops, local retail chains, niche manufacturing (bicycles, automobiles, outdoor equipment, supply chain components, whatever you're interested in), hospitals, museums, universities, school districts, etc.

These employers are often less discriminating when it comes to tech skills (especially the smaller ones), and the interviews would be more general... fewer coding challenges (if any), more about teamwork, overall cultural fit, your ability to do other semi-related tasks (SEO, graphics, etc.). They don't hire the best coders, nor do they pay the most, but they are a great way to get your foot in the door.

I got my start in a similar way, first with HTML/CSS/Wordpress (mostly self-taught), then rapidly learned other skills along the way, mostly on the job. A few years later I decided to specialize in the frontend. Pay went from $15/hr to about ~$50/hr in about 3 years. Definitely not tech sector pay, but more than a livable wage for sure. And great work-life balance. My particular field is clean energy, and it's a still-growing sector with a lot of tech-adjacent opportunities.

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