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Comment by turtledove | Hacker News Reader

Yes, but not in the way you describe. Software engineers have power right now, we should be unionizing (even if the union is only pushing for things like IP clauses and non competes to be less draconic). Build the union while we are strong so it's there when we are weaker.

A union doesn't have to be a huge monstrosity. It can be simple and fight for a few basic standards in the industry.

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The purpose of a union is to create a labor cartel which tends to standardize the price of labor above the rate at which the market would likely set it. IP clauses and non-competes are a small part of the issues plaguing our industry. Putting constraints on the labor supply is probably not a good thing; it leads to the market for labor relocating to less union-friendly climes. Ask anyone from Detroit how well that worked out.

Software engineering doesn't rely on factories, and less labor friendly areas produce worse products (ask Boeing about that.)

Apple and Google aren't going to just shut down in California because a union asked them to give some concessions that materially improve engineers lives.

> The purpose of a union is to create a labor cartel

No, that is not the "purpose of a union"

Some unions, especially in the USA, have functioned in such a way, but this is far from universal.

'Labor market' is a purely American concept. You shouldn't be switching jobs constantly and relocating. It takes a toll on personal life and makes no sense anyway.

It's still a "market" so long as there are supply and demand, regardless of how frequently a given participant is conducting transactions in that market.

The housing market is probably a good example. Many participants probably only purchase property once or twice in their lives (less even if you consider the case of a married couple buying a house, that's 0.5 purchases per person).

I've worked for three different employers and have never left this spare bedroom. Relocate? Where? To my living room? :-)

Unless you live in a communist country, you are part of a labor market.

I don't think there are any purely communist economies operating in the world today, and even if there are, there is still a market. It's a badly distorted market that performs poorly, but a market nonetheless. If you have human beings involved, there's a market; it goes with the territory as part of the human condition.

Workers coops are neither labor market nor necessarily communists. If everyone democratically operates the company and shares equally in profits, there's no wage labor being performed.

Among many offers, I chose a company on absolutes, not relatives. The culture is good, and I want to make serious products that serve a purpose. I get paid less than my peers but enough for a living. Is that communistic?

You are simply pricing in external variables to your compensation, which is part of how markets work.

I get what you're saying but I wouldn't program web apps for 3x the pay even. I don't "feel" the American way of switching jobs and being a general purpose programmer.

Too late for that now. With Remote Working becoming mainstream, you'll need to coordinate workers globally to create a union.

Everyone just needs to send me $1,000 a month in dues and i'll start sending google and amazon some very strongly worded emails on our behalf.

I'll do it for $950/month!

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