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I am an idiot. Would this mean that the time stays as it is right now (after the change from this past weekend)? Because I would love that so much.

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Yes, it means we would get more sunshine in the evening during the winter.

And we are going to have to go to bed one hour earlier, and get up one hour earlier, relative to sunset/sunrise. It makes no sense.

Who is the "we" you're talking about here

Every single person affected by this change?

It makes perfect sense, we'll get an extra hour of sunshine in the evening.

But many people don't care about that, and would rather not get up an hour early every day relative to actual night and day cycles.

Luckily enough, the (loud) minority on this one is getting overruled.

But many people don't care about having extra sunshine in the morning and would much rather have an extra hour in the evening. Many probably consider "actual day and night cycles" to be a man made construct anyway.

There's definitely two sides to this but it seems most people want daylight in the evening rather than the morning, so saying "it makes no sense" isn't being intellectually honest, to be honest.

Why is your preference more relevant than mine?

Yes! Later sunsets in the winter!

Since it's anyway going to get dark way before dinner (5:30pm in NY), does it really matter?

Yes, because now it gets dark at 6:30pm instead of 5:30pm and you get an hour of sunlight after work or extracurriculars to absorb vitamin D.

The most likely outcome is, that work schedules shift as people struggle to get up in the winter. Consequentely the amount of light after work doesn't change. Actually its worse than with the time changes, where there was an effect on the amount of light after work in the summer.

You really think society is going to collectively upheave itself and move to 10-6 in the wintertime just because its tougher to get up an hour earlier? If I were you I would not be a betting man.

Yes, I do. Not in an instant, but over time. That is what happened after introducing DST to some extend. Here in Germany DST was intruduced in 1980. Most stores open up later than they did back then. And they close later. Office hours used to start at 8, now its more like 9. School in some places start later or there is discussion to start later as pupils struggle to keep awake in the early hours in the winter. You can also see the effect in all places, which do have a significant deviation of their official time with the course of the sun. Take lunch time. Thats often not at 12, but shifted according to the difference. Germany, France and Spain are in one time zone, the meridian is going through the east of Germany. If you look at the day rhythm between those countries, you can see this effect very strongly. Lunch and dinner times are shifted pretty much exactly with the difference in astronomical time.

So I am pretty sure that after introducing permanent DST there are two possible outcommes:

- people shift their time tables to compensate

- if the time tables are not shifted, there will be a lot of unhappyness in the winter and a lot of pressure to change back the time shift.

Completely disagree. The outcome will be that people wake up in the dark during winter and have an extra hour of sunlight after work year round.

All experience with these kind of time shifts shows exactly the opposite. This is not, how the human body works.

It's easy to say "oh the research shows we should do this." It's much harder to actually do it. The amount of coordination required to get everyone to agree to change schedule is far to high for it to actually happen.

Nope it's 5:30 instead of 4:30.

My understanding is that that the house has no plans to pick up this senate bill. So this was a purely symbolic vote. Nothing actually happened. This bill has not made it into law and most likely never will

What is your understanding based on?

"Republican Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida, a sponsor of the legislation, said he doesn't have any assurance the House will take it up" in https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/15/politics/senate-daylight-savi...

Plus the fact that this is not front page news, which I think it would be if we actually made daylight savings time permanent. :-)

>time stays as it is right now Correct. We still have a couple of years/cycles before this goes into effect. So starting March 2024 we will "Spring forward" permanently

It's actually really hard to remember which is which, isn't it? lol. I get confused all the time

Yes

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