Julia Ioffe, Masha Gessen
It's partial but has a lot of detail
On the other side there are the Russian friendly views such as Mearsheimer or even Stone.
It's difficult to weigh what is true (even though I'm biased anti aggressor in this case)
I don't know that I would refer to Professor Mearsheimer's view as pro-Russian, he has plenty of criticism of Putin and the Russian political system in general. But the fact that he has been railing on the likely consequences of our approach for dealing with the Russia/Ukraine situation for years, and been proved right, should make his writing and interviews required for anybody seeking to better understand who we got here.
Is that not a coup? Is that not a recipe for war?
1: Democratically elected stretches reality towards the end. The end was not a free and fair democracy nor free and fair elections.
Yanukovych was an autocrat and stooge. copying many of the same tactics as his protector Putin to stay in power beyond public support: suppressing opposition, faking votes with international orgs deemed un true/not valid election, using his private military to intimidate and suppress.
The people of Ukraine WANT to join the EU and be a part of European trade. Perhaps not all but a vast majority.
That's the crux of Maidan.
Yanukovych said he would sign the economic agreement which had broad support across the country. But did a 180 and ran to Putin (literally and figuratively, he physically fled). If any country was holding a gun it was Russia.
2: It was not a coup. This was not a military take over, decapitation by a 3rd party nation, or middle of the night execution.
He was removed through an act of parliament after IMENSE popular opposition via democratic sentiment/uprising among the people.
Even if that act itself wasn't laid out exactly in their constitution, what came next were legitimate free and fair elections which is indisputable.
People and countries should be free to chart their own future.
To remove themselves from the foot of authoritarianism and to rewrite and reimagine their government towards Democracy, European trade, & freedom.
A bully autocrat & former controlling country shouldn't be allowed to shut down the will and future of tens of millions just because they have a larger army and threaten nuclear war.
Way to bury the lede. This is the issue. The coup was illegal, was it not? That doesn't even mean it was necessarily wrong, but can we at least be honest and call it unconstitutional?
I guess it's a debate about etymology but coup does not fit reality imho.
That also supposes that the laws were being followed in the first place.
They weren't.
People have a right to chose their government. If the government abuses the people and ignores the rule of law and democracy the people are right to seek better government.
I wouldn't have a huge problem with that characterization, I'm not saying all coups are bad just call it what it is though. The main difference in 1776 though is there was no new leader put in place into an existing government system. The entire government was rebuilt from the ground up. In Ukraine, they just installed their guys.
I kinda agree that the putin logic is far fetched..
The only person responsible for the invasion into Ukraine is Putin, it was entirely optional, no matter who predicted that it would happen.
Also: there is a substantial number of HN accounts in recent times whose only purpose seems to be to plant Russian talking points and I wonder if those are mostly by useful idiots or by hostile parties, so be careful whose water you carry.
I'm sure you will find a way to tie each and every man, woman and child murdered by Russian soldiers to 'the West' but it isn't very believable, even if you have to find the need to quote a professor (your appeal to authority was noted).
Shall we stick to the world as it is? Also, that's a pretty bad analogy, and no, it is not 'essentially the same'.
Again, can you please stop with the dumb propaganda pieces trying to West-Wash the Russian invasion into Ukraine? It is beyond boring. If it is your goal to drive people away from HN by rehashing the same inane arguments over and over again that is of course your freedom but since you, as a new entrant are not gaining anything and we lose something it would seem that this is a non-zero sum game where in the end we're looking at a net loss.
The only party responsible for the invasion of Ukraine is one V. Putin and by extension the Russian state. Attempts to drag the past in by the ears or otherwise are counterproductive. If anything NATO should have accepted Ukraine because we already know the result of not accepting them. See also several treaties that Russia just decided to wipe its arse with.
[1] https://apnews.com/article/970e8e54b3df46eab593e9e11beb056d
[2] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-ukraine-tape/leaked-a...
You have been called out on your "CIA Coup" propaganda before, regarding this event: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity
It's boring.