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Comment by hungryforcodes | Hacker News Reader

How does that work though?

Vietnam (unlike Cambodia and Thailand) has no long term retirement visa. It would be particularly insane to build your life around having to renew your tourist visa every 3 months...

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For US people, it used to be very easy to get a "business visa" that was good for a year.

If you lived in Saigon, you'd do the Moc Bai border run with Cambodia once a year. Drive (or bus) a couple hours to the border. Literally walk over the border and walk back into VN. On the way out and back in, you can pay some coffee money for faster service. You put a 200k or 500k note in your passport at the desk and they put it on the top of the stack.

It was kind of an entertaining process.

> You put a 200k or 500k note in your passport at the desk and they put it on the top of the stack.

Can you imagine the hell you'd get in if you tried this in america?

That was the truly entertaining bit. Tons of scammers hanging around pushing some sort of service. Rightly so, a lot of people get frustrated or uncomfortable at border crossings. I've done VN/Cambodia/Laos border crossings enough times that it doesn't bother me. I understand the game now. It really is just part of the way things are done.

I kind of wish it was that way in the US. Even paying off corrupt cops right on the street in Vietnam. Far better than getting a ticket and going to court.

Exactly! It's almost a feature.

Not to mention that you still need to pay taxes to the IRS even if you live abroad.

Want to not pay taxes? You must renounce your US citizenship. Want to renounce your citizenship? You must now pay an expatriation/exit tax on your assets that can range from hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars for some retirees.

If you are born in the United States, you are truly stuck here and forced to pay a forever tax by virtue of being alive.

I don’t think those people really care about paying US taxes considering life is so cheap in Vietnam. The mere fact of not paying American prices for housing, healthcare, food, etc is a substantial discount. The tax money they lost will not make that much of a difference there, as opposed to Europe.

US LTCG taxes are ridiculously low (0% under the 15% tax bracket), and that's going to be the primary income source for early retirees. This is such an overblown argument unless you're working overseas and then you're often very well paid AND countries often have tax treaties to give you a break.

Middle class, working-age Americans with normal IT jobs in the EU sigh, look longingly at their (if lucky) dormant 401k/Roth accounts back home, realize they really are going to be working until retirement age because no one will open a brokerage account for an American here, and that while tax treaties generally prevent double taxation on wage income, things get “fun” on just about anything else.

If I lived abroad, I'd make my parent's address my primary address and keep all us accounts tied to it. Transfer money via crypto stablecoin (Ironically, sending money internationally is crypto's only killer app) and invest with your US accounts until you gain whatever residency / citizenship that allows one access to the financial system in your country.

That is a terrible idea come tax-time if you claim residence abroad.

Also, according to expat chitchat, Vanguard is particularly good at sussing out clients who claim Stateside addresses but don’t actually live there.

Americans living in foreign countries have to pay taxes on income over $100k if I’m not mistaken. You do still have to file though. Which is bullshit. And the expensive , laborious process for renouncing citizenship is also bullshit.

Is it really so bad to just keep your US citizenship?

I understand that, if you're working and making any reasonable amount of money, you're going to get hit with a lot of double taxation, which sucks. Plus FATCA and the other annoyances.

But say you're retired with a modest burn rate. Then, between the Foreign Tax Credit and the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion, you won't really have to pay much in US tax, right?

But then you have another problem. If you renounce your citizenship -- which passport will you use to enter into Vietnam, or which ever country you'd like to stay in.

Looking it up there is a $2m threshold before this tax matters. Then there are various yearly tax exclusions and credit that make this negligible for average retirees.

There's a foreign tax credit up to $100k. So, for the retired, I don't think paying extra tax is an issue.

Foreign Earned Income Exclusion. Not any other sort of income, including things like parental leave benefits.

(Not exactly) Pro-tip: if you are in pretty much any EU country, and have anything on top of earned income (rental income, any form of government-paid benefits), you are possibly better off not claiming the FEIE - there’s a reason you have to specifically request it when filing, and it’s not because the IRS want to be jerks (about that, anyway).

I guess one could have hidden accounts or have them in banks that won't work with the US gov, and live in a non-extradition areas...

That's what Eduardo Saverin did (one of the co-founders of Facebook). Settled out of court, moved all the money out of country, ran off to Singapore, and renounced his citizenship. Dodged some $700 million in taxes. IIRC he's barred from entry into the US for any reason until he pays back taxes or something.

If you simply never go back, the odds are high you will never be bothered by this. And if you won't be bothered, the rules are not important.

> Vietnam has relaxed visa rules to lure American retirees like Rockhold, along with their savings.

It seems like they must have a new category?

I know someone who fought for South Vietnam in the war and is now a US citizen who travels there for a month or two and comes back, alternating time between a home here and Vietnam. Obviously it's easier for someone who is fluent in the language.

Thailand and Cambodia rules aren't so straightforward either

I don’t know about Cambodia, but Thailand offers a 10 year retirement visa. You need to be over 50 and show 10k in a bank account.

It’s 24k and has to be held in baht at a Thai bank.

Which is fine. They're reliable and you'll need it anyways. Can get interest on it even.

It's actually reasonable compared to the retirement visa requirements in Malaysia.

Ah I was mistaken, thanks for the correction.

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