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Comment by andrew_ | Hacker News Reader

This sort of shaming about how exactly someone should be, and how they’re failing to live up to expectations by not doing what parent is doing, is presumably exactly why this material exist. Thanks for illustrating to everyone why this might actually be useful.

> beta male audience

You lost me there.

> get your ass to a qualified and experienced therapist and work through your issues, rather than turning to an online support group for answers

If you're feeling bad, do this arbitrary thing instead of this other arbitrary thing to fix it. Alright.

Couldn't agree more. Holy hell this guy has issues.

You seem to have to no empathy. The fact that you think everyone operates like you clearly says a lot about your mindset.

> This is clearly written for the beta male audience, and I don't care if I'm roasted over that statement

Exactly, that's what we need labelling people.

> so you can be the strongest person for your children

You don't need to be strongest person all the time. You don't and you can't if you think that you are being that I am sorry you are wrong. And if you actually are being that, then you are basically setting up your kids to always show a strong face even when something's crazy wrong. YOU DON'T WANT THAT.

Hey everyone loves their children, but to assume everyone loves their children exactly way you love yours is being exceptionally naive.

In what world is strength and loneliness opposites? Or strength and other negative feelings. People can be strong and sad lonely miserable at the same time.

I'm a dad of a 5yo girl in therapy since 2 years, both alone and with my soon to be my ex wife, a woman who grew up without a father and now thinks our girl doesn't need one either. I'm surely not a beta male. Not at all. Almost all my friends have no children. My therapist has no children either (in Italy there's a big, big demographic crisis). At work in Italy you don't talk about your personal problems, it sure hurts your career, empathy is not a desired human trait. Your experience is yours only, I'm glad it has been positive, it's not the same for everyone. Every help that could help is ok.

The science on this is well established and available in layman's terms all over the web... girls need a dad and they need him early, and often. Send your soon-to-be former spouse this information. If necessary ask the Court to appoint a 3rd party advocate for the child.

I'm sorry that you're going through this situation and I'm glad that you've reached out for support long ago. I hope things settle down soon for you and your kid.

Thanks for sharing these details about Italy. I had no idea. Is it the same for moms there?

You seem to take issue with "long, emotional, draining, and lonely journey." by accepting that it is the first three, and you solve the fourth with "if you're lonely why aren't you keeping in touch with others?". That last point seems like an unusual complaint against something that is intended as a community where people can keep in touch with others.

> get your ass to a qualified and experienced therapist and work through your issues, rather than turning to an online support group for answers

I generally agree with your sentiment (though find it a bit inflammatory for no real reason), but what on earth is wrong with online support groups? These are extremely effective for lots and lots of people.

Honestly it sounds like you may be the one who should seek therapy.

> I just spent the day dressed up like a pirate catching beads, pounding beers, ripping shots of rum, laughing with friends, being absolutely ridiculous, and came back to a 3 year old telling me that she "loves me so much."

You wrote this three days ago. Is parenting after day drinking to excess what one should consider the antithesis of "beta male" behavior?

Babysitters exist. We arranged one for that event, and should be considered responsible. Anything else you'd like to try and drag me on?

Here's the original reply for context: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30133543

It's telling that you decided not to answer my question and responded instead with a loaded question. I'm not sure what part of my response suggests that you would leave a three-year-old alone for hours. You could contend that simultaneously "pounding beer" and "ripping shots of rum" is not drinking to excess. But suggesting that the intent of my question is to "drag" you is putting words into my mouth. I wanted to know whether your parental anecdote served as an example of the opposite of what you called "beta male" behavior.

My three year old is all about Mom and screams at me to "go away" when she's around. Not all kids are the same and not all parents will have the same experience. This prick calling dads looking for support "beta male" is exactly why it can be a lonely experience as a struggling father.

Maybe it is for a "beta" male audience, but it can also be for the many fathers who don't have the fortune of having a present partner or an excellent relationship with their kids.

Also, I don't agree that "any content is useful". Men and women are different, and maybe I will get roasted for this, but it's true. The life experience and sensibilities of men and women can be very different, and only having access to a mother's perspective (which also happens to be the mainstream-approved perspective) is inadvertently gaslighting; if a father naturally has certain male perspectives on raising a family but the mommy blogs they read tell them otherwise, that's very alienating.

You’re describing the ideal but not every dad is at that ideal state. I do think therapy is important. No one said this app is a panacea. It can be a useful tool for dads who are struggling. Also, strength will always fail sooner or later. Even if a person reaches the ideal attitude toward fatherhood that you describe, they’ll inevitably stumble or at the very least they’ll need help to stay up.

I agree the pitch is poor, but the homepage makes me more interested.

Dad-tip: if this were selling a "4-minute dad" approach it would be up my alley. As in, give me a digest of all the books my wife is reading about parenting, so she doesn't have to. Help me schedule time to consume it (before bed is good for me).

Poor pitch: we'll get better. Thank you for your patience. It's my first time posting on HN and I'm nervous.

4-minute dad: you can literally read parts of guides for 4 minutes and then get back to your life.

Parenting book digests: spoiler alert, we're working on it... in 3 weeks if all goes well. But only with the paid membership.

This is a super unkind comment. Really not sure why you went with it.

Dude...WHAT!?!?! I really hope that's a troll post.

Hey settle down, ok?

You added nothing of value with this.

You, plus anybody that agrees, ping me. Email in profile.

Becoming a father was the best decision I ever made. The duty of fatherhood has made me a tenfold better man.

Fatherhood is not a bitter load to be carried. It is the greatest responsibility you will ever face, the true test of your character, and a duty to be met with great joy, energy, and devotion.

> Becoming a father was the best decision I ever made. The duty of fatherhood has made me a tenfold better man.

> Fatherhood is not a bitter load to be carried. It is the greatest responsibility you will ever face, the true test of your character, and a duty to be met with great joy, energy, and devotion.

None of these are mutually exclusive. The idea in our culture that something is either all good, or all bad, is an incredibly shallow way of experiencing life. Fatherhood is fantastic, and it's also difficult. There are times it is wonderful, and there are times it is terrible. It's both. Don't try to reduce everything into a one dimensional caricature, otherwise once you find a negative you can't explain away, you'll revert to the "this is horrible, it's only horrible", which is just as wrong.

If you need an app to be a good dad, you don't need an app...

Reply on news.ycombinator.com