German and French politicians have sold their soul to Gazprom.
Nato cannot rely on these countries against Russian threat.
Nato cannot rely on these countries against Russian threat.
Up 300% in the last 2 months. We cannot afford a war, it'd make the COVID crisis seem trivial.
US interference (see the Burisma board, supporting gas tariffs and opposing Nord Stream 2) brings us to the brink of war - and, much like with the Middle Eastern refugees, Europe must pay the price for US imperialism yet again.
It's painful to read so many American comments treating it like a game, when they have nothing to lose - safe thousands of kilometres away, and won't be affected by the energy prices, etc. either.
If you make your energy 100% dependant on Russian dictatator then you deserve those high energy prices.
For you it is high energy prices, but for Ukraine it is life or death.
If war starts, the sanctions need to be painful, whereas Germany is like "we're okay with sanctions so long as they don't affect us in any way whatsoever at all".
Things only really get very dangerous, if the Russians got the idea that NATO wouldn't stand together.
Deploying a few thousand troops from various NATO countries to eastern European NATO members is just posturing that serves to ensure that an attack on one is an attack on all.
Besides, increasing troops in eastern European NATO countries is allows negotiators to offer a joint de-escalation. It carries little risk, and small cost.
or ... perhaps ... posturing like gorillas beating their chests in front of the home of a nuclear armed and scared ape can have catastrophic consequences
But not posturing could be worse. It's worse if Russia can't predict our response.
A better example is that it's just like what lots of Americans were saying about Russia and Ukraine immediately before the invasions and occupations that are still ongoing began, but with “beyond Ukraine” replacing “Ukraine” now that facts on the ground have made the latter more obviously indefensible as a claim.
Gorbachev, whose ambiguous statement about a feeling of betrayal when NATO did expand in the east beyond the reunited Germany is the source of the myth of the promise, later explicitly stated that no promise was made and the issue was never even brought up.
(And it's not as if the USSR and the USA didn’t understand the use of memorializing important agreements in writing to prevent later disputes about their scope and content.)
[0] https://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-shifrinson-russi...
That just does not prove NATO agreed not to expand.
on the other hand, russia was attacked multiple times by western european countries and lost millions of its citizens. i think their unease at an alliamce which you yourself say is hostile, is justified
But whether or not it was open for discussion, no commitment was, in fact, made and Gorbachev has himself—after inspiring the myth by a vague statement about a feeling of betrayal at NATO expansion—acknowledged that and gone further and saying that a commitment on the issue was never even discussed as part of the negotiations.
Saying something could be part of a deal as an inducement to get someone to the negotiating table doesn't automatically insert it into the deal, or even guarantee it gets talked about in the negotiation.
It is funny how all these warmongering Eastern Europeans always have war with Russia on their own territory. Really makes you think who starts those wars...
oh you mean when 250000 Romanians, 250000 Hungarians and some Croats decided it's a good idea to fight the battle on the Volga? (look at the map). That _is_ funny!
Wait, who? Preparing to defend yourself in case Russia decides to go to war with you isn't the same thing as being willing to go to war with Russia.
If Germans really want to avoid war they should start by clearly saying that the NordStream 2 pipeline project will be cancelled and the permits revoked the same day that Russia either realizes the threat of mass invasion.
The rest of Europe is pretty united in this matter. I worry mostly about Germany when it comes to things like sanction votes in the EU.
And the Gas dependency is going away. Perhaps it's worth ripping off the bandaid. It's only Germany and parts of eastern/central europe that still heats up with gas right (Asking from Northern Europe where I don't think we ever did ).
Ah, those mean Russians, force-feeding the poor Europe their poisonous gas. Reminder: the Western European countries voluntarily entered into this relationship and have been buying the gas for many decades. They are absolutely free to buy their energy from anywhere else in the world. Case in point, that's how France currently gets 25% of their natgas and they have been happily living with this "dangling sword" for 45 years, why would they do that?
US interference in the case of gas is trying to ensure alternative supplies for the EU, either American LNG or from Qatar.
> Nato cannot rely on these countries against Russian threat.
I think that's a big stretch.
Everyone should be better than falling for the cliche narratives like that. Politics is complicated, and everyone has their own definition of what a soul is.
François Fillon (Prime Minister of France from 2007 to 2012) is a board member of SIBUR, the largest petrochemical Russian company.