This topic aside, I guess I just feel like if the Hacker community is saying “don’t build things! It’s dangerous! What if someone gets hurt! Go DMV! Put a stop to that!”, then maybe I don’t want to be a Hacker anymore.
[edit] I'm pro EPA too btw, its nice that rivers don't catch fire.
What I'm seeing is that Tesla's appraoch, fleet learning, is likely to accelerate the advent of L4. If Tesla can solve this using the existing cheap camera sensors, they can scale this out incredibly fast. This year they are likely to produce upwards of 2 million vehicles, and by 2025 it's likely close to 6-7 million. Even if other self-driving solutions get there first, they have no way of reaching Tesla's scale as they need specialized sensors and partnerships with OEMs etc.
Consider the possibility that I'm right. By stoking fears and getting FSD banned or delayed, many lives would be lost in the name of safety, when there has been no fatality recorded on FSD.
I think this is simply a cost-saving measure. They have not developed a sufficiently reliable system, they are marketing it as though it is, and putting it on the road. I strongly suspect that they do not in fact require more data to perfect this system - I suspect they need more sensors. If they do need more data, they're free to obtain it otherwise.
Autopilot has tried to murder me a few times lol.
I don't want to see that experimental learning happening on public roads which are shared by people who are not willing participants in the experiment.
Every time a Tesla crashes into a barrier killing the driver that is sad, but at least they chose that fate so ok.
When Teslas cause damage to other cars or humans who didn't want to be part of the alpha program, that's criminal.
It's not like there's nothing between 0 safety features and FSD. We could just have passive safety features like AEB and LKA and get a ton of benefit over nothing...
Millions of people are able to drive safely, and do, every minute of every day.
73 per cent of American drivers consider themselves above average [0].
[0] https://www.insurancejournal.com/magazines/mag-editorsnote/2...
I don't doubt that there are many safe drivers out there, but probably fewer than we think. With modern cars, you can risk a lot before having an accident.
Basically saying that the quoted statistic (90% or whatever) is a way to NOT look at how road design contributes to the error.
Earlier on this threat, someone commented that a road marked as 50 mph often has cars driving 150 mph on it, because it is a shortcut which is build like a racetrack. Obviously 150mph in a 50mph zone is human error, but a few simple changes to road design could take away the 150mph attractiveness of this road.
Or see some of the articles on stroads, or badly placed left turns, etc.
FSD might be a step to better road safety, but a focus on designing roads for safety might also be a good step.
If that is what the community is saying.
May I suggest an alternate "if", based not just on your statement, but on the general tone of this whole article?
I just feel like if the Hacker community is saying "react emotionally based on if we like Tesla or not and just yell at each other without trying to communicate", then maybe I don't want to be a Hacker anymore.
While we're at it, let's argue that FDA shouldn't worry about drug/vaccine trials? Perhaps as soon as a company makes something, it should be given to the people, since hackers. I'm sure pharma companies will love that, human lives be damned.
If I say I just ate a lot of rice, do I define how much rice I ate by the percentage of global rice consumption I accounted for?
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Please, 2,000 cars is mass testing.
To me it's pretty clear that Tesla's audatiousness in pushing FSD could move up the advent of L4 by years, possibly saving hundreds of thousands of lives, for very little downside. In fact, I believe human+FSD is already safer on average, just due to the fact that FSD requires the driver to watch the road.
Are you saying that 'Full Self Driving' is safer because it is not full self driving?
I want my culture back.
I have no idea why that's clear to you. Seems to me from the FSD Beta videos that not only Tesla isn't in the same ballpark yet as the companies that are going for offering geofenced L4, but it doesn't seem to be improving much. Then there's the fact they've handcuffed themselves by widely promising/releasing the product with the hardware customers already have.