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It's pretty easy to lie to a border control agent. That's also pretty high on a list of bad ideas.

Also knowing Italy, nobody checks. Really.

I took a plane from Italy to Greece a couple of months ago: completely vaccinated and with the Passenger Locator Form ready.

Nobody, literally nobody, checked in a reliable way wheter:

- we had a valid COVID Certificate

- our PLF was filled correctly

The only moment during my trip where anyone checked was at Starbucks.

This doesn't mean that you are entitled to lie to the border control agents though.

I've travelled internationally maybe a couple of hundred times and never had my bags searched (that I know of, who knows for ones checked in at airports) until one trip a few years ago when I arrived back in UK and customs officers pulled me over to spend 15 minutes making me get every item out of both of my bags.

It's a bad idea to travel with false paperwork, as it's a bad idea to travel with anything illegal in your luggage, not because there's a high chance they'll definitely look into your situation, but because if they happen to choose you randomly then the punishment can be severe.

Yeah that’s the kind of thing I’d use a throwaway account to talk about …

Agreed, but I don't think the commenter you're replying to is claiming to have lied to border control agents. They're just pointing out that no one was actually checking their documents for validity, and the one automated check that happened wasn't even accurate.

This is correct. No lying was needed (we did do the tests, they were negative, etc.) Only I was forced to alter the documents because the automated systems kept rejecting mine due to my birthday being too close, but outside of the window (as evidenced by it immediately accepting it once I removed my birthday).

No, MrDunham didn't lie, not in any material way, but he made this comment: "After we arrived in Rome I realized I could have literally found a copy of the email on the Internet, put my name and test time in, and uploaded."

That's what I was responding to.

Depends on the country. I would expect Italians to be far more relaxed than Americans.

Fact is that people plainly don't know how official or authentic information looks like in case of anything Covid. Was at a barber last week and he has to check my vaccination status. I presented my QR code, she looked at it for a few seconds and then was already happy. You are supposed to scan it with another app but nobody seems to know this... Perhaps she can read QR codes in her head?

I recently gained entry to an NBA game out of state (away from home and without access to any valid paperwork) by using devtools to edit the results page of a test I had last year, to make it valid for that day, and then printing the page. The clinic in question is all over the state and partnered with a major regional hospital, and they use a very basic means to print the page; just some media css.

For every burden of proof, enterprising people are going to find a way around it. There's now a vast market of spoofed, lookalike QR code destinations on the web that your average Joe isn't going to be able to spot the difference for in a quick glance. WRT gaining entry to the NBA game, the person inspecting paperwork didn't spend more than a half second looking at what I presented. I could have simple printed "negative" on a piece of paper with a bunch of Lorem Ipsum. It was complete theater.

I had a similar experience; no one scanned my BinaxNow proctored test's QR code. Just having one was enough; I could've easily presented a doctored screenshot.

There are probably spot checks, and I don't doubt the country I was in would have happily detained and fined me had I failed one, but it was a bit disconcerting right before hopping on an eight hour flight with a bunch of other people subject to similarly lax enforcement.

My proctored test didn't even have a qr code, it had some 20 character unique id but I highly doubt anyone would take the time to call the phone number and verify, having gone out of the country a couple times and back in. For the US side these are the flight check in clerks checking, not even government agents.

It's honestly insulting how easy it would be to fake. As a law abiding citizen, we jump through all these hoops, but as a criminal, you spend 5 minutes at home in photoshop and your test is 99.99% guaranteed to work. Hell you edit the unique ID I was talking about to just be invalid, I bet even if they check they'll just force you to get tested again thinking it was a system error.

> As a law abiding citizen, we jump through all these hoops

This is not like a regular law where evading the law and the negative outcome are 1:1 correlated E.g. smuggling a bomb onto a plane. In this case the people who lead to a negative outcome are not aware that they have the virus.

If you think you don't have COVID then the upside to faking a test is low enough that very few people take that path.

I'm not sure if that's true, if you have to travel for some reason and you take the test and are found to not have covid, you obviously don't have any reason to fake it.

However if you're going to a wedding/see family member/some other trip you value, and you do test positive, you now have quite a good reason to fake it, and if at any point in the past you have a valid test with no QR code on it, could easily modify the date.

A plane is one of the least likely places to catch Covid thanks to the constant air circulation and filtration. Cabin air is entirely replaced every 2-3 minutes, which is quicker than the air circulation in negative pressure hospital rooms.

That's likely to prevent "the whole plane got it" scenarios, but a lot less likely to prevent "the person sitting next to me coughed the whole time" ones.

I flew to Cyprus in October from within the EU. Had an EU vaccine certificate which was supposed to mean that no test was required for me. Also had some Cyprus health form I filled out with a QR code. But they made our whole flight stand in a crowded line, inside a building, and instead of scanning the QR codes from our documents, they manually wrote down our names and phone number on a piece of paper, and then made each of us take a COVID test on the spot, and then sent us through immigration before our results came in. Our vaccine certificates and other documents were never checked. Apparently, their plan was to call us a few days later if a test came back positive.

I flew to Spain (from elsewhere in the EU) in September, my wife was not vaccinated so had to do all the extra paperwork and antigen tests both ways. We registered online with the Spanish health ministry before flying and were provided with a QR code, you have to say whether you are vaccinated, and if not are told you need to show a private negative test result on arrival.

On the way we were asked if we had a negative test at the airport, we showed it but they didn't look at it. On arrival they just asked to see the QR codes, not the test result.

The actual private antigen test results could very easily be altered with Preview.app. Most that we've done so far have a QR code that goes to a hosted version of the certificate, but nobody has ever scanned it. I wonder what would happen if you change it to a URL that returns a 404 - or even just remove it, one I took recently didn't even have that.

Security theatre for sure. Whenever I've travelled, I've been more worried that I might not have the right paperwork than catching COVID.

> Whenever I've travelled, I've been more worried that I might not have the right paperwork than catching COVID.

That's the enforcement mechanism that ensures the test is legitimate, not the QR code.

If you fake a test result then you've committed fraud in a foreign country. If you take a real test, are positive, and travel anyway then you're knowingly violating the law and there is a non zero chance you'll be caught.

I don't see how it is theatre when you admit that it achieved its aim of having you and your wife take a test pre- travel.

Related: I got a big snicker out of DefCon this year requiring proof of vaccination. "Uhhh don't y'all host presentations on how to fabricate credentials?"

Hah! This got a nice laugh out of me. Can't imagine the number of unique challenges that arise due to DefCon's audience and content. (Not implying bad, just... different. For example fabricating credentials.)

I used to host some small-mid sized events (100-200 person hackathons) and that was difficult enough without having anyone poking around at my security/processes.

You can do rapid test remotely, by doing self test via skype with doctor. It gives you EU valid cert, all legal.

This is literally what people are doing in my area to fake COVID vaccine verification PDFs.

Your story doesn’t make any sense. Rapid tests have been available in America since at least the spring. Also you said you were going in September and Memorial Day is in May.

"Available" and available are two different things, and I'd guess OP probably meant Labor Day instead of Memoridal Day.

I can say that in my area of the US, the only tests that could be found were PCR, 2-3 days for results.

Thanks, you're correct on all counts.

Labor day. The tests are "available" but not available anywhere nearby for us. PCR only (maybe they're actually available now, but they weren't then.)

Anyways I really need to stop posting to HN in the AM before I've had enough coffee... I make too many half-brained stupid mistakes.

He's obviously thinking of Labor Day. I mix them up myself. I believe HN guidelines suggest steel manning here, not accusing him of being nonsensical because of a simple mistake.

Also, programmers often confuse Halloween and Christmas, because OCT 31 = DEC 25.

Not only are you correct (I mixed them up), but now I know about steel manning and am a fan. Thanks for the support and understanding - have a wonderful day!

Crap. Yes I meant Labor day. You'd think since my mother went into labor with me on labor day, I'd actually remember it.

That's what I get for posting in the morning. Good catch.

Probably meant Labor Day

Shoot. You're correct. You'd think since my mother went into labor with me on labor day, I'd actually remember it. Thanks.