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Comment by md8z | Hacker News Reader

I'm not trolling, I've personally suffered psychological harm from online abuse. There are many places on the internet that I'd like to go but can't because people are too abusive and nobody does anything about it. What am I supposed to do if people don't even want to talk about this or acknowledge that it's a real problem that we can solve?

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When I was a kid my teachers used to say to me "sticks and stones can break your bones but words can never hurt you" when another kid said something mean.

Were they wrong? Yes, as an adult I've found that words can actually be quite hurtful. But usually from people I already know.

Strangers? I don't think strangers can hurt with words, they are strangers after all, unless they get your real identity. I think a lot of the problem people have with "trolling" is actually caused by self-doxing. When one person is anonymous and another person is under their real name, it creates a power imbalance.

Realistically, people can post on the internet from 200-odd jurisdictions, this is not something that the law could or should be preventing.

Those teachers were very often enablers. And to add to it, had they tried to actually deal with issues instead of blaming victim or expecting the victim to just take it, the overall situation might have been better.

The words in fact can hurt and always did. Men used to kill each other over who said what. Words can damage reputations and make other kids mistreat the victim too.

It is easier to say the above sentence then to deal with kids verbally abuse others. It is easier to tell the victim to shut up then to teach the victim to defend himself, to undo damage to their self confidence and so on.

you... don't... go there.

This isn't a hard concept. I don't willingly walk into a mine field, but some people do. I'd totally accompany them if I also had any of the dozens of mine detecting, or detonating tools, vehicles.

You may have a moral obligation to stop people from being hurt, but you have no moral obligation to stop people who willingly choose to be hurt, or accept the risk it.

You are in control of the media you consume online. If you don't like the online community standards, leave and block that community. Or develop the equivalent of mine detection or explosive resistance coping mechanisms for verbal for visual abuse. Before you walk into the communities that permit hostility.

I've already been doing that for decades and I hope you can understand how it's impractical to do that. Social media has network effects, that's the whole purpose for it to exist and some people just expect you to meet them where they're at.

I totally understand that. I consider myself fortunate enough to have learned to ignore it while a teenager (thanks "I'm Offended", if you know, you know :D). That's not to say things don't bother me, or that there's no one living in my head rent free right now. Only that ignoring vast the majority of things I don't like is a learnable skill. Such that I can safely visit any website I want without worrying about it running my day, or causing other psychological harm.

Then don't engage with them.

Why would you want to go to a place where people are too abusive? I try to avoid such places. So far it's working out for me alright.

Because I don't think these places (Twitter, Facebook, etc) need to be places where people are too abusive. My impression is that a lot of people who are there aren't happy with the abuse there either.

So you're trying to make the world a better place? In which Twitter becomes the better version of Twitter that you believe it can be? I wish you the best of luck.

Well no, I'm just trying to get the conversation started because the article mentioned that this was a pain point for people. If you have suggestions I'd love to hear it. I don't have all the answers, as I mentioned before this is something that needs to be decided collectively.

Don't go to places if you can't deal with the environment.

Definitely trolling

Can you please have a conversation with me instead of accusing me of trolling? If you want to change my mind then I'm open to it, but this isn't the way to be convincing.

No more conversation allowed.

jails you for trolling

I get that you are trying to make me the butt of a joke, but you'll notice my original question was if we could come up with a objective definition. If you don't think we can then you could just say so.

Burden is on you. If you think one can exist, go ahead and try offering it so we can evaluate it.

You're not wrong, you're just an asshole. They're asking in what is obviously good faith for a cooperative conversation. To which you respond with an attempt to distract, followed up with "Burden is on you." Something they've already admitted given they're seeking input on the topic. I can't imagine why they wouldn't want to offer a solution for your evaluation. You're clearly trying to help them out right? You know by suggesting solutions or opinions about problems that will need to be solved? Oh no wait... you're explicitly taking no position at all. Very brave...

> nobody does anything about it

Insist that there is a fault with the results of education?!

> that we can solve?

How?

Why do you want to a place that makes you feel bad?

What exactly do you mean by pscyhological harm?

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