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Comment by tdrdt | Hacker News Reader

A lot of people don't know what privacy is. They use the argument 'I have nothing to hide'. But that is not what privacy is about. Privacy is your ability to control what others know about you.

A lock on a toilet does this. The ability to hide your IP address does this.

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“Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say.”

― Edward Snowden

"Privacy is the power to selectively reveal oneself to the world" ~ Eric Hughes

It is not, however, the power to force the forgetting of secrets already disclosed.

Paraphrasing this for pop culture shock:

"Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care if someone watches you take a shit because you eat healthy food." - LocalH

And it goes well beyond technology, I’ve long felt that the biggest problem with income tax wasn’t the tax itself but the audacity that anyone needed to know what my private income was, let alone to treat me differently under the law based on my income.

The 4th amendment was penned back when you would have had to physically search my house or business for paperwork to learn anything about my financial books, I really believe that the original authors intended for me to mind my own business and the government and everyone else to mind theirs.

Freedom was free agency to exist and thrive in the land, unmolested and protected from encroachment from others by the government, rather than being a subject of the nation and a pawn of the government.

Taxes were something taken at ports during import/export, now not only is the representative system turned upside down but the federal tax collectors have turned inward.

The federal government was suppose to be an entity of management for external foreign relationships and mediation between states, now it’s getting close to mandating individuals to which private bathrooms they are allowed to invade.

> A lock on a toilet does this

I found that this one doesn't work on Americans, they have some crazy 2 inch gap around the door haha

In America, privacy, like so many basic rights, is freely available to those who can pay for it.

Someone could be smoking weed or worse use their smart phone on company time.

> They use the argument 'I have nothing to hide'

That """argument""" is what people without any experience, just come out a cave hours ago, could put in their head. Under Pol Pot, people had to hide eyeglasses. And this is just an example that stands for many other instances.

But are there examples that are more salient to your average civilian with non-controversial politics that lives in a developed democratic nation?

Yes. For example here on HN a blind programmer posted once he/she often had to hide the fact he/she is blind initially to get a job.

But the average person isn't blind. I'm looking for cases that will resonate with the average person.

> average civilian

Why should the average be relevant. Phrased this way, it seemed that the object of concern are the grayest.

> with non-controversial [positions]

Are those who decide what takes the label of "controversial" reliable?

Basically, I'm looking for something that will resonate with "the average Joe," so to speak. Talking about people in dictatorships or people who are political extremists, yes those people need privacy. But how can you convince the average Joe that they need it too?

> Are those who decide what takes the label of "controversial" reliable?

No -- but the average person who finds themselves squarely within the Overton window will not find that concerning.

Joseph McCarthy.

A lock on a toilet doesn't prevent anyone knowing what you're doing in there, to a very high degree of certainty. If privacy is "what others know about you" then "you have bodily functions" seems to be something else other than privacy.

Well the next thing I would ask is their bank account credentials...

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