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Advertising is lying. How can you trust anything the sellers of products say? They will obviously attempt to emphasize the pros and minimize the cons. There's a massive conflict of interest in advertising that can never be resolved. I want real information from real people who actually use the products, not what the seller paid some ad company to tell me. I usually obtain this information by directly asking the humans in question, they usually don't come to me unsolicited like the ads do.

> the odd time I setup a PC and have to open a gaping browser, it's such an assault on the senses

Oh god I know exactly what you mean. I install uBlock Origin as soon as humanly possible but that short window of time before it's done is such a bad experience.

> Advertising is lying. How can you trust anything the sellers of products say?

I firmly believe this. However, I try to be more objective these days and even if I hate/disagree with something I still like to find some objective facts/data about things to see stuff from other perspectives.

Even if I find research that says everyone on earth likes ads except me, I won't change my personal stance on them.

Edit: forgot to add that by lying, I was referring more to the click rates and returns and whatnot, rather than the claims of the products that are advertised.

OK, I was actually in Google Ads (the first time) 2008-2010, and saw the results of zillions (technical term) of experiments, where pCTR (probability of a click-through) was one of the variables measured against the control.

You're right -- it's nothing like 30%, except for maybe some extremes, e.g. "mesothelioma" where the user really wanted that information.

A few percent.

>I've asked on here before but is there somewhere out there in the internet that I can see unbiased research on ads. Something! Anything at all?

Is this possible? If you are stating from the go that you do not trust the numbers so you are doing your own study, isn't that a bias already?

Not really. I mean a study that's not from a company that sells ads or is in the chain somewhere! Any studies (I use the term very broadly) that I've seen are all net positive!

I want something from, say, The German Institute of Being Really Honest, who are government-funded perhaps... a few studies from entities who don't have a dog in the fight is all I'm after.

If their conclusion is that people are happier with ads then so be it... I'm happy without them, that's for sure.

It’s not like you’re unbiased either.

Why can’t you believe some ads have a clickthrough of 35%? You never see ads so you don’t know how good they can be, right?

Also, you see ads all the time on HN. This whole site is a marketing/advertising campaign for a VC company.

Personally. I love to buy stuff and I love to click on ads for things I might want to buy.

> It’s not like you’re unbiased either. Correct, I'm not. I can't stand ads. And to clarify, I mean traditional ads like banner ads, billboards, TV ads etc.

Ads come with tracking now... that needs to die immediately!

And I'm not talking about sites like HN: I know who owns it but they're not actively forcing me to watch some claim that "This thing will stop you being an ugly bastard and make women throw themselves at you"...

In fact, UBlock Origin shows nothing on this site.

> In fact, UBlock Origin shows nothing on this site.

That’s the very best kind of advertising. The kind that has fooled you into thinking it’s not there.

Ok, if I squint really hard I can see where you're coming from but if I took your stance I would have to disconnect from the internet.

Every site has logs. They can all see where I've been, what I've looked at, how long I looked at it and so on. I get that part. I'm a developer. I build that stuff myself.

However, I need to draw the line somewhere and using UBlock Origin and never ever seeing an on-page advertisement AND minimising all tracking is the threat-model I'm targetting. And, I'd reckon that most people who care about privacy would stop about there too.

With HN, there are no distractions on the screen. Nothing flashing or moving or asking me to sign up or anything... that's what I am trying to prevent.

In any case, lets say I could stop everything and still let the text on a web page through on my browser... just the text, nothing else: we've seen in the past how even that is a signal that can be tracked.

We can't stop it completely but I feel that I'm doing my bit to make it less effective and hopefully, eventually, pointless.

In a way, what you’re OK with is more insidious because it’s tricked you into believing it’s real content. Now you’re even defending them, a far cry from the original ADS ARE BAD sentiment you started with.

Yeah. And some of us fetch HN via rest apis in json. Tracking? Ah, no. Nice hanging out with you guys 'here' :-)

The ads are the content, not the tracking.