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ekianjo

> What is stopping infections and deaths? The vaccine.

Vaccinated people still get and spread infections - They simply dont get much symptoms from it.

This kind of comment is exactly why people don't understand what the "vaccines" actually do.

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You need to believe vaccines stop infections to be able to blame the unvaccinated for the continuation of the pandemic.

I don’t blame the unvaccinated for the continuation of the pandemic, but they can clearly be blamed for overflowing hospitals. The vaccine sharply reduces severe symptoms and long term symptoms.

which overflowed hospitals?

You need to believe that vaccines stop an adequate proportion of the infections between vaccinated individuals to believe full vaccination would end the pandemic[1].

But you don't even have to believe that when it comes to the relevance of the pandemic. Looking at the number of people who are vaccinated (or bellow vaccination age) and go to hospital or die in my country it would be a severe but acceptable flu season. Does every severe flu season need a pandemic response?

(1- Within the round of first infections. You can actually believe that it is insufficient on contagion but ends viable mutation and will end the pandemic by using delta as a booster.)

Ah, the old ‘vaccinations will prevent mutations’ fantasy.

Even if you believe it is possible to vaccinate the entire human population world wide and that vaccinations prevent infections, covid spreads through animal reservoirs. Are you suggesting we can vaccinate all animals?

Mutation in animals typically lower it's viability in humans. So the question is if I have been vaccinated and there aren't enough unvaccinated people to jam hospitals, why do I continue to care about viruses in animal populations that are just like any other virus that might pop up the next time someone licks a bat?

If I'm willing to take any sort of vaccine for it when it becomes viable again in humans, then I'm safer once it is purely in animals than I was before it was present in humans.

> Mutation in animals typically lower it's viability in humans.

What is that based on? The Marseille IV mutation of COVID19 came from an animal reservoir and had no issue to cross species and it was one of the deadliest variants.

I don’t know why you continue to care. All I see are people clinging to their precious mask mandates and pushing for vaccine booster shots, with the ‘hospitals are filling up’ and ‘the unvaccinated cause mutations’ excuses. But as has been known from at least a year ago, hospitals are filling up with the vulnerable population so that would leave no reason for vaccine mandates on the not vulnerable population, like young people, and vaccinations do not prevent mutations.

There are breakdown for hospitalized in Switzerland:

https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/vaccination/breakthrough

Switzerland runs with a much higher infection rate and faster economy than Germany because it has many more beds per million. These beds are being occupied by more 20 somethings without than 80 somethings with vaccination.

I'm annoyed by the slowness of things in Switzerland, I'm impacted by the even more absurd slowness of things in Germany. And all of this is from people who voted down pesticide regulations and water regulations so they don't care what ends up in my body.

The west behaving this way on public health while viewing libertarian ideals as justified whenever they are economically good and accidentally hurt people is the kind of insult to morals that I think correlates to western decline.

Cumulative numbers for the entire length of the pandemic:

  Hospitalizations for 0-9: 199
  Hospitalizations for 10-19: 85
  Hospitalizations for 80+: 2142

Breakthrough hospitalizations:

  60-69: 47
  70-79: 73
  80+: 107

I’m not sure what you’re seeing in this data. Perhaps if you pick and choose age groups you can make it look like more young people end up in hospitals than old vaccinated people. But you’d have be really selective.

20-29 is twenty something, already they need more beds than the 80%+ of 80+ year olds that vaccinated and those 20 somethings aren't the ones who know they had a medical problem unless they were seven orders of stupid and still didn't vaccinate.

Looking at the older working age groups we have more than 50% vaccinated in most and something like 100X less chance the vaccinated go to hospital. So if you hate restrictions then get vaccinated so we don't have to come up with creative ways to protect a hospital bed from you.

*Those numbers are not since the pandemic began but since the vaccination began. The oldest age group and people with health issues were vaccinated first so comparisons should be biased against the vaccinated, but it is too effective to see that bias.

You do know it is possible for people to be vaccinated and still be against vaccination mandates?

Anyway as you insist on calling people stupid and just want to force your opinion on others I’m through discussing you.

To be clear I'm saying the only way I know to make:

> hospitals are filling up with the vulnerable population

From the Swiss numbers is to really assume the worst in people.

>Vaccinated people still get and spread infections

With a better immune response, infected people are also less contagious. So technically, yes, vaccines stop the infections.

> infected people are also less contagious.

Complete bullshit. It has been demonstrated in several publications that the viral load among vaccinated people is just as high as unvaccinated people, and viral load in key areas like the nose is what spreads infections.

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