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throwkeep

Sitting member of Congress: "No more policing, incarceration, and militarization. It can't be reformed."

https://mobile.twitter.com/RashidaTlaib/status/1381745303997...

Sitting member of Congress: "We can’t reform this."

https://mobile.twitter.com/AyannaPressley/status/13817027443...

Activist with 475k followers whose name is currently: "DEFUND & ABOLISH POLICE"

https://mobile.twitter.com/BreeNewsome

Ben & Jerrys: "This system can’t be reformed."

https://twitter.com/benandjerrys/status/1381743962558504969

When activists say they want to abolish the police, they “100%” mean they want no more police, Noor says.

https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020/07/17/black-lives-matte...

NYT op ed: "Yes, We Mean Literally Abolish the Police"

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/12/opinion/sunday/floyd-abol...

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Highlighting "a very very small niche" of politicians/activists isn't really debunking the "a very very small niche of the police reform community" claim.

I like Ayanna Pressley and Rashida Tlaib, but they can hardly be claimed to be the mainstream portion of Congress, or even Congressional Democrats.

The entire point of the slogan is that it can reasonably be interpretted as both a call for measured reform and a demand for radical change. Activists switch between these interpretations at will.

Also, within activist circles, the most radical interpretation always wins. You're on HN and so you claim you want to "divert resources" but within "ACAB circles," the winning argument is always the most radical (prison abolition, prison = slavery, police are modern slave catchers, violence against police is justified). This pull to the extremes is what disturbs me about radical movements. It's possible that these movements have a positive effect when they interact with moderates and some kind of compromise is struck but the movements themselves are quite scary.

It's a slogan that's perfect for using in a motte-and-bailey way.

Perhaps they should have chosen a slogan where the dictionary definition differs from the opinion of "a very very small niche".

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/defun...

"to stop providing money or as much money to pay for something"

It's easy to make someone look reasonable if you ignore their unreasonable statements.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/aboli...

"to put an end to something, such as an organization, rule, or custom"

I'm not sure we're discussing the same thing.

Ayanna Pressley and Rashida Tlaib are police abolitionists. They're also quite unusual in Congress in this position.

"Defund the police" and "abolish the police" aren't the same thing. That's the point.

Fringe congressmen and an op-ed written by a fringe organizer aren't really evidence of what the common consensus is.

No True Scotsman defense incoming, as people pretend that a “very very small niche” is what it means when high-profile congressional members put forth positions that are not vigorously denounced by the media and their political allies.

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