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Comment by Koshkin | Hacker News Reader

I get what you are saying, but we have to learn to live meaningfully, with the internet being now an inalienable part of our lives.

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Why? The Amish are the extreme example, but you can minimize or even cut out the internet from your life if you want to.

In addition to what the other responder said (the Amish generally have some tech stashed away for use when necessary), a part of being Amish is being part of a community of other Amish people. Just like in a Orthodox Jewish community you will see Sabbath mode elevators on Saturday, Amish communities have access to services that bridge the internet and their moral code. There are services that will print stuff from the internet and have it sent to you, or an outsider accountant that manage your internet-accessible financial services. They are not really cutting the internet or its consequences from their life but rather in some cases cutting out their direct interaction with the internet.

In Europe, more and more banks have been slashing opening hours and the number of clerks at physical locations, or even closing locations outright, because customers are expected to do nearly everything through online banking. Many forms of interaction with the state require using their online portal, and even if you visit the government office, they may just show you how to do what you need through the online portal instead of helping you directly. Programs to assist people who do not have a phone and internet, now focus on giving those people a phone and internet; there simply isn’t willingness to make technology optional for that tiny demographic that eschews internet use.

Yes, the Amish have managed in the USA so far, but I think that even those days are numbered. Just as many Amish already own mobile phones, though they limit their use and keep them stashed away most of the time, they will be forced to do online things, too.

Much like the Amish will probably have a community mobile phone rather than a personal one a good middle ground for the rest of us could be public libraries. Government services and banking typically don't need frequent access so you don't need a personal internet connection just for them.

I'm ashamed to admit I didn't think of this earlier recently when I needed some printing/scanning done. I went and bought a cheap hp cloud printing (they don't even come with cables anymore) abomination. After trying to get that to work, screwing around with HP accounts, configuring a cloud printer from a linux desktop, installing an app on my phone, etc I ended up going to the local library and got it all done in 30 minutes It was cheaper, easier and better option for something I need to do a few times a year.

The problem with recommending public libraries is that government and banking services may require specifically a mobile app on one’s phone, not a website that can be used from any library computer.

>Programs to assist people who do not have a phone and internet, now focus on giving those people a phone and internet

This is smart though, since it costs very little to give someone a smartphone with internet these days (ALDI talk in Germany is 8€ a month with a bit of data, a cheap smartphone maybe 100€).

Trying to keep up a service that <0.1% of the population uses costs a lot more.

Having grown up here I think a lot of people would freak out if you had to use computers for services. The town I grew up in doesn't even let you pay taxes online in 2021.

Also not a lot of old people is computer savy in Europe.

And by old I mean > 55-60.

I saw some article suggesting that actual computer savviness is on the decline among people under 18 as well due to the growth of iPads and phones as the primary compute platform for the younger generations.

> we have to learn to live meaningfully, with the internet being now an inalienable part of our lives.

The Internet isn't what gives meaning to life.

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