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Comment by tluyben2 | Hacker News Reader

I do not know why anyone uses them still. I find them awful in every way. Will stay-cation if I cannot afford the ticket with another airline.

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Let's see, will fly with them tomorrow. Faro->Porto (550km). 9.95 euros. 50 minutes flight

Train-> 6 hours, which is usually 7+ due to delays (last one I did in December was 7.20 making me late for a training) and costs 39 euros (20 if I buy 1 month in advance)

National airline -> No direct flight, need to fly to Lisbon and then Porto, total around 4-5 hours (two flights + layover), 80+ euros last time I checked. Service exactly the same (last time I used them, not even a glass of water was offered due to short fly times)

Car -> 5 or so hours, around 100 euros taking in account tolls + gas (is ok if 2+ people are doing the trip though)

Yeah, I will take the short sitting space (fuck, I would even stand in this route if needed, I have had longer train rides where I had to stand).

People get so uptight about cheap airlines (especially the cheaper it gets, as if it's supposed to get better). It's a bus in the sky that takes you 10x farther, 10x faster, and is the safest form of transportation in existence!

"Ooh I'm so cramped, and I didn't even get a free meal" so either deal with the hassle, time and cost of any other form of transit, or fork over 300 more euros for a big seat on a different airline!

I live in the US, and we almost never get Ryanair prices. I think I've paid 12 euros to fly Ryanair between two countries. That's insane.

> Let's see, will fly with them tomorrow. Faro->Porto (550km). 9.95 euros. 50 minutes flight

> Train-> 6 hours, which is usually 7+ due to delays (last one I did in December was 7.20 making me late for a training) and costs 39 euros (20 if I buy 1 month in advance)

Look, I do not strictly disagree with your comparison and I have often taken low cost airlines for the same reasons here and in asia (though airasia is a whole other class above ryanair so i'm not sure it's fair to compare them).

But you're missing four important things:

1. those 50 minutes are actually at least 90 in reality, from entering the starting airport to leaving the destination airport, when taking into account check in and baggage, depending on the crowd.

2. the airport they use is off the city by a fair bit, adding at least 20 minutes of car or rail travel + costs, often both side (in and out)

3. if you need to add any kind of baggage + the link to the city, you end up costing the same as train

4. depends on rail link but here in france for such travel it's common to have a tgv or similar, which gives you ample room for your legs and a proper table for your laptop, along with power, so you can work

Low cost airlines have their advantages, but it's not that clear cut over train: 2h/2h30 where you can't do anything and unpleasant vs 6h where you are not cramped and can reliably work and / or relax. At least for intra-national travel at eu-scale train should be majorly pushed, and I personally agree with my country's plan to do so.

While I know in other countries it isn't like this, here Faro/Porto is the same airports that Qatar/Tap/SwissAir, so it isn't a difference at all.

I never travel with baggage. Even in not cheap airlines, this add 30+ minutes for checkin and pick up also

I gave examples for Portugal. All these I did a lot. I used to travel Porto->faro and back many times a week (work in one place, my son in another). There is no real option here unless you are a full anti-flight person. I took the train down to faro last week but only because I wanted to do a training and times werent compatible, otherwise I would have flown, there isn't even a comparision here

I live in Faro and when I have to fly, I drive to Malaga and fly from there. But yeah, that is not to Porto but international. Never flew inside PT (inside spain, I do fly malaga Madrid with air nostrum ).

I used to live before near Malaga, but they didn't at the time (I think now they do) Malaga->Porto direct flights. it was a shame

ps:I am in vilamoura for that last night tonight, if you want to grab a drink ping me ;)

when I lived in Granada, to travel to Madrid was either 6-7 hours by slow train, or 1 hr by bus to Malaga then 2.5 hrs by fast train, or... 5 hours by first class bus service directly from Granada. The first class bus included food and what seemed to be unlimited beer and wine for like 30 euro. No comparison. This is my favorite option for point to point travel in Iberia if there is no fast train nearby.

Because you'll often be faced with a 500 euro+ fare for a short flight on the national airlines, with either one of WizzAir/RyanAir offering the same flight for 20-80 euro.

9/10 times the service is near-identical to a flagship. 1/10 times, the sub-par exception handling reveals itself. That's a trade-off I make regularly to save 400 euros.

There is a major difference: space. I cannot sit in a ryanair/transavia/whizzair seat for more than takeoff before the person in front has destroyed my knees. Most "premium" airlines have 1-2 inches more space and the option for more spacious seats.

That is true. Not a major concern for most shorter people though. As a teenager I once did a 12 hour flight (with refuel stop) on a charter 757 with 29" seat space. Didn't find it terribly uncomfortable back then to be honest. Apparently Ryanair has 30" space.

I always buy extra leg-room (like seat by emergency exit), because I am tall as fuck. Problem solved.

I fly a lot with RyanAir, WizzAir and the other discount-airlines, because what they offer is great value - and when you upgrade a bit, it is not terrible.

A ticket listed for 50EUR, I usually end up paying around 100EUR with extras (legroom, luggage allowance).

They are cheaper until their not. Family booked a flight to Colorado from Georgia one winter to go skiing. Spirit let us know an hour before the flight that out flight was overbooked and offered us another flight....4 days later.

We ended up coughing up an extra $1200 to fly Delta and Spirit never refunded us because "we could have taken the flight we offered". Last time I ever flew with a budget air carrier.

Now I fly Delta, I pay more per flight but I've been screwed over in the same manner exactly zero times since. In fact Delta has gotten me out of situations of my own doing that Spirit or any budget airline would have shrugged at and told me to suit myself.

At this point I consider the premium on airfare an insurance policy of sorts, might pay an extra $100-200 per flight but if that means not running the risk of screwing up a trip I paid thousands to put together, I'll take it.

The DOT has very specific rules about passenger compensation for passengers "bumped" off of flights via denied boarding:

https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer...

"Over 2 hour arrival delay 400% of one-way fare (airlines may limit the compensation to $1,550 if 400% of the one-way fare is higher than $1,550)"

What they did in your case was illegal. Which has happened at Spirit before: https://www.transportation.gov/briefing-room/dot-fines-spiri...

You can file a complaint here: https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/file-consumer-com...

When did this go into effect? Years back we tried to land twice due to fog then had to wait overnight with no accomodations to take the bus zero compensation. Still won't fly Southwest because they merged with the offender.

Weather cancellations/delays don't count as denied boarding. These rules apply only if you're bumped due to overbooking.

I was more talking about the overnight delay with no food or accommodations after the 2 failed trips in.

Yeah, they have government regulations for that in Europe, but not in the US.

"There are no federal laws requiring airlines to provide passengers with money or other compensation when their flights are delayed"

https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer...

The only regulations for delays in the US that helps passengers is some specifics about not stranding you in the aircraft/tarmac for more than 3 hours (domestic flights) or 4 hours (international flights).

I don't think you understand, friend. The airline market in Europe is like a whole different world of deregulated competition. For example: ryanair operates a scratch card gambling thing on all of their flights once they reach cruising altitude. Because this is considered similar to international waters, and Ireland's advantageous gambling laws can be observed. (as a result, they will do anything they can to fill seats. Planning to make up any loss on cheap tickets elsewhere. I'm talking bonkers shit, like flash sales on 99c tickets)

Assuming you don't get caught by every hidden charge along the way, an airplane ticket isn't going to cost you >$100, even if you spring for "business class".

I think insurance would make a better insurance policy in your case. (especially when the airline tries to rob you)

*regulated. In the EU if a flight is > 4 hours late you are entitled to financial compensation. You don't get that in the US: https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/passenger-right...

The situation in the US with budget airlines is not comparable to Europe. Europe has very strong consumer protections.

From just a small percentage of cancelled Ryanair/WizzAir flights I am actually not far from all-together free flying after they paid out the compensation.

The really annoying part is that there are no reasonable prices. Often the options are for example Ryanair for 50, or KLM for 500. I'd happily pay more than 50, but I'm not paying 500 for a 2h flight.

Easyjet are even worse. During corona they canceled bookings for British tourists wanting to get back home and resold the flights for 5x more while trying to claim kudos for running "rescue" flights.

I would prefer to fly with Ryanair these days.

They have €5 flights from Dublin to other European countries this summer. That is why.

They run quite a number of routes between smaller cities than no other airlines does.

I agree that they are one of the worst, in almost every sense. But their service level have, in my opinion, actually improved.

I use them a lot since they are the only ones which fly where I am going.

O‘Leary himself said some people will walk on broken glass to get a cheap flight. They completely own offering a shitty experience.

And I understand it: 2-4 hours of "bad" flying experience is not that much compared with 10 days holidays in a location that with other companies can cost you 10 times more...

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