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Comment by brundolf | Hacker News Reader

The Elder Scrolls games are polarizing because they're not fun in the traditional sense (they got better on this axis over time, but were never great)

The fun of an Elder Scroll's game, for me, is the sense of aimlessness in a world that doesn't feel structured like a quest-checklist, but like a world. Something I can poke and prod and truly make my own goals and activities in. You could almost call it "meta-fun". The individual actions aren't fun - some in Morrowind are almost painful - but the big picture is enthralling for someone like me.

But not everybody's like that; and not everybody likes them

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What are some modern equivalents of this type of game

RPGs like the Baldurs Gate sequel are very structured

Outward in my mind is the best modern rpg in Elder Scolls style, and with that I mean a great focus on the atmosphere of the world that you walk around in and immerse yourself in. I played Morrowind as a teen with 5.1 sound and absolutely loved it, strong memory of going through that long valley into the northern desert area, immersive game.

Now Outward is a third person game made by an indie team, but the game has matured a bit now and they have released three DLCs. You got some factions, have to chose your build, cook food and sleep in the wilderness. And it has great outdoors areas that you are just gonna fall in love with, and really great music to go with the exploration. And the nature and creatures in the game actually reminds you of Morrowind. A real gem.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nN8fSxg7cEs&ab_channel=Play4...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rD0vqPnbQPc&ab_channel=PlayS...

I've had the very same feelings playing Elite Dangerous. Of course it's a space sim, not an RPG. But it had this sense of a world living without you. And a ton of mechanics where each one seems boring on its own, but allows you to build your unique complex stories and memories.

Many mmorpg can be played like this. You go out and explore, and basically ignore the main plot.

Crafting games can be somewhat similar, where the main objective is more of a theme in the background.

Baldurs Gate is to my memory a game that focus fairly strong on the main story, and so I find the experience quite far away from Morrowind. In that game you did not look out and see a big mountain with wonders of what might be lurking there.

Pillars of Eterntity 2 is incredibly open world. The main plot is there, but it's the exploration and faction quests that are what you actually spend time doing.

My main gripe with PoE2 (and the later Elder Scrolls games too) was that the urgency of the main plot detracts from the freedom of exploration and the flow of faction and side quests. Morrowind was great about this: you get to Caius Cosades and he tells you to go do other things before he gives you your first orders. There are a few other stopping off points in the main story too. It makes the faction quests and just taking your time exploring make so much more sense.

Yeah, agreed. The story in PoE1 made way more sense in that sense. The game itself is just so amazing than I forgive a lot of the plot-related holes.

The worst part is that it's clearly set up for a third which will almost certainly never happen.

The de-protagonising is definitely a concern also, but I file that under the "Empire Strikes Back" approach (i.e the second can end on a cliffhanger (sortof)) which will all be resolved by the third.

I think it's more that they coln't decide if they wanted to make a follow-a-god-around-and-skype-with-some-other-gods-but-but-not-impact-the-story-yourself game or a pirates-versus-companies-versus-natives-faction-builder game so they just made both and released them as one. The exploration it has is not really the same as a TES game.

Witcher 3 is fairly similar. Although it has a lot of quest markers and directions in game, it still feels very vast, open and inviting to explore. I spent the first 30-40 hours playing Gwent (an in-game card game) and chasing all additional cards for it. Main story had to wait

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