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Comment by finnthehuman | Hacker News Reader

This article is unactionable fluff.

I shouldn't be too hard on myself? gee thanks, a fortune cookie can tell me that. And it's a shorter read too.

Why does the obvious question go unacknowledged by this article? The question is roughly "How does someone calibrate how they reflect on their actions and effectively guide themselves through life?" People are not tough on themselves for no reason, it's a (possibly misguided) attempt to push themselves towards their goals. If you tell them to be self-compassionate without answering that you're setting them up to resist your advice.

What deduction am I to make other than: the article doesn't address the question because it doesn't have an answer.

NB: I have an answer that works for me; I'm talking about how good this piece of persuasive writing is at providing one for people that don't. But thanks for the advice.

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Can you please stay within the site guidelines when posting to HN? You're arguably on the wrong side of at least 4 here:

"Don't be snarky."

"When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. 'That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3' can be shortened to '1 + 1 is 2, not 3.'"

"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something."

"Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Thoughtful critique is welcome, of course, and you've got the kernel of that here. But it's important to avoid the putdown aspects and to remember how easy it is to misread others and misassess intentions. That leads to gaps in our perceptions, and we tend to fill in the blanks with crap that's actually drawn from our own imaginations (and sometimes is looking for an excuse to vent itself), which typically makes for less interesting discussion.

Don't really agree, bud. The tone was a bit harsh, but it seems like a totally valid reaction to this kind of writing. Certainly not the most popular one in this forum but still valid. I don't share their viewpoint but it feels appropriate to defend it in this case. It seems a bit off to drag out the site guidelines here.

> it's a (possibly misguided) attempt to push themselves towards their goals.

Ist that really so? I think the article is trying to distinguish between three types of self-reflection and only one of them is actually pushing you towards your goal.

1) Punishing yourself and calling into question whether you can reach your goal at all. ("I failed that math test! How could I?! What kind of idiot am I?! What is wrong with me?!")

2) Self-indulgence, which I understand as distracting yourself from negative feelings with activities that bring immediate satisfaction - but neither advance your progress nor give you more insight into what went wrong. ("I failed that math test! I feel like shit! Let's go shopping!")

3) Self-compassion which is more about accepting something happened and trying to find out what went wrong without becoming degrading or punishing.

Only 3) is actually pushing you towards your goal. In fact, the others may be pushing you away from it - 1) through negative and 2) through positive reinforcement.

I think the article's intention is to make people better at spotting the differences and steer their thinking patterns away from 1) and 2) and towards 3). At least that was my impression.

The article includes a definition of self-compassion, comparison/contrasts with other things people do (self-beratement and self-indulgence), links to studies on the topic, as well as resources on how to practice/develop it. How is that "unactionable fluff"? The article itself is not a tutorial, but it gives you access to deeper materials if you're interested.

Do you also expect chapter 1 for a text or the abstract for a paper to explain everything or to establish the motivation and definitions for what follows?

Management by aggression, punishment, belittling, and disrespect is generally seen as a terrible fit for creative or knowledge professionals. Manage yourself how you would wish to be managed by a wonderful manager.

Each article has its own audience. Maybe this article isn't for you, that's cool. Others may find it helpful. Even if you know something, it is helpful to be reminded of it from time to time.

Abrasive people are often abrasive with themselves first, and then rationalize that they aren’t expecting anything from others that they don’t already expect from themselves, and then some. They are just being “fair”.

Lighten up.

The author outlines Neff's work, but you might find a more concrete gameplan in Neff's book. [1] It's based on an eight-week program.

1. https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/the-mindful-self-compassion-wo...

You may find this paper by Kristin Neff more palatable:

https://academic.udayton.edu/jackbauer/PGSG/Neff%2003%20self...

From the paper:

"Some may fear that having too much self-compassion leads to passivity, but this should not be the case when feelings of self-compassion are genuine. While having self-compassion requires that one does not harshly criticize the self for failing to meet ideal standards, it does not mean that one’s failings go unnoticed or unrectified. Rather, it means that the actions needed for optimal functioning and health (and having compassion for oneself means that one desires well-being for oneself) are encouraged with gentleness and patience. Thus, self-compassion should not imply passivity or inaction with regard to weaknesses observed in the self."

> People are not tough on themselves for no reason, it's a (possibly misguided) attempt to push themselves towards their goals.

Maybe that's your reason. It's one I've worked hard to get closer to. For the fist 2/3 of my life it was just amplifying the horrible, misplaced, and often completely unthinking judgment and abuse I received from others.

Consider that some people are actually in a cycle where they reproduce pain for themselves that has been caused by others.

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