Comment by unalone | Hacker News Reader

Comment by unalone | Hacker News Reader

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Wrong, wrong, wrong, WRONG. I think a lot of people who comment like this make such comments because they've never used Macs for any real period of time.

Three off the top of my head: the contrast of dark grey for focused apps to light grey for unfocused ones means that you can see what's focused instantly. This is useful because Apple encourages opening multiple things at once: the green button for maximize sizes most apps so they fit whatever's being displayed and nothing more.

There's no unused pixel. KDE 4.1 shown here has large blocks of matter at the edges of their windows. OS X does not. Likewise, that little grey button on the top right, the one that minimizes bars that you don't need, allows for much more efficient screen economy. No, you don't care, because you like looking down your lengthy xmonad nose at us common serfs, but a lot of us LIKE doing a lot of different things with our computer, and Apple doesn't compromise: we get an efficient system AND one that, you know, does stuff.

Not to reel off Apple's most recent ads, but Stacks mean you can access a lot of information without cluttering your screen, and you can still keep it all organized. Making Downloads into a stack means that suddenly your desktop is blank except for things you drag off from other apps and screenshots you take. It compartmentizes your computer into Downloads, which are things that take a little while to get, Desktop, which are things that you grab quickly, and Documents, where things are organized.

Three given as impulse. I could literally spend hours going into fine detail about the small little bits of polish that Apple has applied to their operating system. You can say a lot about OS X. You could argue that it's not "efficient," though by some definitions of efficiency it outstrips Linux and Windows by far. But you can not argue for its not being polished. Apple is the industry MASTER of user interface, they have perfected the art of polish, and if you say otherwise you are a stupid, ignorant fuck.

I say that with all due respect; I'm sure I'm overthinking your little flippant remark. I upvoted you because your comment leads to a venus of discussion - but you're about as wrong as a nerd arguing operating system on a Y Combinator site could possibly get.

Are we using the same OS? I find the color difference between focused and not focused very hard to see. I hate that the maximize, etc buttons are just colors with no symbols, I can never remember what each one does.

The finder folder windows have tons of unused space that should be filled with buttons for useful actions. I recently did arrange by name on the desktop instead of the folder because I had to go to the menu bar on top and didn't realize the folder was no longer active, so it did the desktop instead.

The folder itself should have buttons that do these things, so I can go directly to what I want. And to make it worse there is no undo arrange!

The mac desktop is not polished - it's sparse. Apple fixes usability and polish by removing functionality.

How long have you been using the OS? After about a week using it I'd had no problems with contrast OR with the buttons up top.

The finder windows, depending on customization, usually show exactly what you need. You don't need to go to the menu bar up top. There are icons in the bar that sort it automatically. As for undo arrange: considering arrange is realigning a view, the idea is that it's not an action per se. So, again, hate to be disrespectful, but I've never come across that stuff myself.

There's no unused pixel.

Really? What about the rounded corners on the top of the menu bar?

No, you don't care, because you like looking down your lengthy xmonad nose at us common serfs, but a lot of us LIKE doing a lot of different things with our computer, and Apple doesn't compromise: we get an efficient system AND one that, you know, does stuff.

I never said I looked down at anyone. I use Xmonad because I think that managing window geometry is a job for the computer, not me. The more the computer does for me, the better. I only want to work on programming, or writing, or reading hacker news; not arranging windows, selecting The Perfect Desktop Background, managing the position of files on a desktop, etc. Those things waste my time.

"Really? What about the rounded corners on the top of the menu bar?"

Which menu bar has rounded corners? The rounded corners of the windows? The menu bar looks pretty flat if you ask me.

"Those things waste my time."

That's something that the Mac helps with for me, actually. Because of how fast Spotlight goes, combined with how thorough keyboard commands are, I find I can go between programs pretty quickly. Though I'll admit that it took me a while to find a good desktop background.

Steve Jobs called, he said to tell you he's ready for his next BJ.

People like you are the sorts of people making Hacker News worse.

Yes, I go over the top when I write. Yes, it can be portrayed as assholish. It doesn't mean I don't try to make valid points when I write. I don't just go through the site, see something saying "Oh, look, somebody expressing an opinion, let's be contrary." I try to write what I feel to encourage discussion (like what happened with some of the other repliers), and I don't censor myself because I think that nobody on the Internet is thin-skinned to start crying when I call people something like "stupid fuck." I don't even say that out of disrespect for the OP. I upvoted the thread. It's just that that's the way that I talk in certain moods, similar to how several other people I've read have snarky attitudes or snappy attitudes or "say the first thing that pops into my head" attitudes. It takes all kinds.

So I give my opinion, give a few examples that I think back up how I feel, and post it, hoping for a discussion. Instead I get several downvotes (which I'm guessing is for tone rather than for lack of useful argument), and a jackass like you popping up to spew shit nobody cares about hearing.

I don't use a Mac because I'm a fanboy. I use it because I think it's an amazing OS, worth the money. Many people use Macs for the same reason. And my reasoning for WHY I like it has to do with the fact that it is, in fact, incredibly polished.

So, at risk of losing my precious karma further, fuck off. I'm trying to have a discussion without sacrificing my mannerisms. You're being a dick. There's a big difference, and it's that what I have to say might actually provoke interesting conversation.

Don't feed the trolls, especially not with long posts.

Thanks for setting me straight, unabomber. I would hate for you to sacrifice your mannerisms, which seem every bit as polished as the Mac OS.

Please stop, both of you.

Was there something wrong with my original post? (I understand that responding to flamebait may have been a mistake.) I was legitimately trying to add to the discussion. And from what I've seen on HN, I didn't think there was a particular ruling towards manners in posts. Would it have been more appropriate to etiquette if I'd been less emotional in my post?

Yes. As it says in the site guidelines, the test is whether you'd say the same thing face to face. I hope you wouldn't say "if you say otherwise you are a stupid, ignorant fuck" to someone's face.

It depends on the situation.

I don't see Hacker News as a formalized discussion area. People congratulating each other and joking with each other tend to be observable in several places. This is a place for smart discussion, yes, but not necessarily formal discussion.

Given that, then yes. I would absolutely say a line like that, expecting people listening in to understand that it's a piece of hyperbole rather than an actual belief. The fact that I then responded rationally when the OP replied should show that, in fact, I don't hold him in any sort of contempt. And, if I was in a setting with reasonably bright people having a conversation, I would use the phrase "stupid, ignorant fuck." The language alone should have made it obvious that I was being hyperbolic to attempt a point of debate.

I guess that's not how you see it, though, so I'll avoid any sort of dialect like that in the future.

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