Meanwhile I'm over here getting a 50% no-limit match on my contributions, which is pretty common in tech.
And while the IRS is trying to match inflation, companies aren't necessarily, so having no limit lets you march along with inflation whereas having a defined limit that your company isn't increasing to keep pace with inflation will leave you falling behind.
my current company has no match.
previous had 4% match but i didn't get anything since i left before 4 yr match vesting.
previous previous had no match.
I assume from context that the 4% you mention is a straight 4%. That is, if you contribute 3% of your salary, your employer will match with 3% as well, but once you pass 4, the employer stops there. So if you're putting in 10%, the employer still just puts in 4%.
Also worth pointing out that the all-source IRS 401k contribution limit is currently $59k/yr, so even with an insane 500% no limit match or something that manages to pass the safe harbor test, there still is a limit you'll hit eventually. It's high though.
Tesla provides all its employees with stock options[0] and has had one of the best performing stock prices in the market.
Why on earth would I want a 401k when I can own Tesla stock at a discount? Musk is making all his employees wealthy.
[0]: https://electrek.co/2020/07/06/tesla-meteorite-rise-employee...
Because investments should be stable and at least partially reliable as a backup plan - if Tesla goes bankrupt and ceases to exist then not only do you lose all your Tesla stocks, but you're also out of a job at the same time.
Presumably, a company with Tesla's market cap does not go bankrupt overnight. Even Google, which is no longer the place where the best and brightest want to work, is nowhere near financial decline. Employees, being insiders have plenty of time to prepare for a large company's collapse. (Black Swan events notwithstanding.)
As for investments: I'd much rather trust myself than trust a money manager who's been outperformed by my boss for over a decade.
Where would I go to verify this claim? It feels vaguely believable to me, but that feeling is likely from reading similar unsourced claims in forums like this one.
Talk to the smartest and most accomplished engineers you can find in San Francisco and comparable locations. Ask them where they want to work. Talk to headhunters.
Talking to the most capable and ambitious people is how you find out which way the winds are blowing.
no that's not always the case - it's up to the individual to think for themselves what they want their investments to be. Tesla shares held by employees may want to keep it for the potential future growth. If they dont, they are allowed to sell.
forcing all employees to choose a "stable" investment option is just patronizing - let them choose for themselves.
Tesla's PE as of right now is 1,324. Which, unless they take over the entire automotive market puts them heavily into the "overvalued" category.
Its hard to imagine that tesla will still have the same valuation in the 10, 20, 30 years it might take a line worker who doesn't have tens of thousands of shares/options.
Also, most people I know in the "tech" environment now expect RSU's instead of options, because a huge percentage of the people i've talked to have stories about their options which expired underwater after a decade.
Putting all your eggs in a single basket is just a recipe to be like the huge percentage of enron/etc workers who overnight went from employed with a solid stock/401k/etc retirement to standing in food lines as they both lost their job as well as their retirement.
Lately. For now.
Investing in a company on its way to being in the Top 10 may give decent returns, but once a stock is in the Top 10 it tends to trail market returns by 1.5% per year:
* https://www.pwlcapital.com/are-the-largest-large-cap-growth-...
The Shiller CAPE tends to predict future returns pretty well:
* https://www.advisorperspectives.com/articles/2020/07/20/the-...
What's Tesla's CAPE?
Latacora has a 100% no-limit contribution match and non-shitty funds (access to all of Fidelity's index funds), loan provisions, and all conversions unlocked for any reason, available on day 1, with all contributions immediately and fully vested. We also eat every fee we're allowed to eat.
(FWIW: I am personally the trustee on the plan for effectively the same reasons. It's pretty tricked out, and I'm very proud of it.)
Add all that together, plus all the smaller companies that also have great plans (like Netflix) and we're talking over a million employees in tech that all get the effective benefit of the company contributing 50% of the IRS personal contribution limit. I would call that common.
> Apple is 50% match up to 6% of salary
Err yeah. He said "no limit". 7% and 6% are limits. Very normal ones (5% is the most common limit in the UK). I've never heard of unlimited matching.
I get you but I think Musk doesn't accumulate wealth in the way you are thinking here. And that in general he at least works the same shitty hours and conditions he expects others to work. A relevant interview:
Döpfner: Are you looking for places?
Musk: No, I'm not really buying any places. I stay at a hotel sometimes.
Döpfner: Where are you sleeping tonight?
Musk: I'm just going to be sleeping at the factory in one of the conference rooms.
Döpfner: You'll be sleeping in a conference room in the factory?
Musk: Yeah.
Döpfner: Alone?
Musk: That's my understanding, yeah. You've got to get a feel for the situation.
Döpfner: You said, in a recent quote, that possession just weighs you down. And that's why you want to get rid of your possessions. And that's why you have literally started to sell property. You have sold belongings. Is it more a metaphor or are you literally selling your belongings?
Musk: I sold my primary home.
Döpfner: The one in LA?
Musk: It was done two months ago. It was actually bought by a guy in China. And then I sold the house I own across the road, which used to be owned by Gene Wilder. It's very much his personality, and I sold it below market to his nephew who grew up there. And then we're in the process of selling my other houses. I guess I'll rent a place somewhere.
Döpfner: So why are you doing it? Because it's too much of an obligation, or it's limiting your freedom? You are considered to be the second-wealthiest person in the world. And now you are getting rid of your property.
Musk: In fact, I'll have basically almost no possessions with a monetary value, apart from the stock in the companies. So, if things are intense at work, I like just sleeping in the factory or the office. And I obviously need a place if my kids are there. So, I'll just rent a place or something. And a lot of the time it's just me, so I don't really need a big place.
Döpfner: So, no art collection, no cars, no real-estate property, no other stuff that we usually associate with wealthy people. Do you believe that getting rid of all that makes you a free man?
Musk: Yes, essentially, I think that also. Like the reason that I am accumulating wealth, if you will, which is really just stock in Tesla and SpaceX. The only publicly traded stock I own is Tesla. That's it. If Tesla and SpaceX go bankrupt, I will go bankrupt personally. One-hundred percent. But I also think, why should I try to have stock anyway. Why do I have all this stuff? Going back to what I was saying earlier, I think it is important for humanity to become a spacefaring civilization and a multiplanet species. And it's going to take a lot of resources to build a city on Mars. I want to be able to contribute as much as possible to the city on Mars. That means just a lot of capital.
Döpfner: And you want to focus on that?
Musk: Yes, and I'm also just trying to make clear that I'm serious about this. And it's not about personal consumption. Because people will attack me and say, oh, he's got all these possessions. He's got all these houses. OK, now I don't have them anymore.
https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-interview-axel-spr...
This is not at all an excuse for pressuring others to do the same.
This interview is completely irrelevant. What he decides to buy in his personal life has nothing to do with his wealth, and doesn't change the fact that he's one of the richest people in the history of the planet.
He could just as easily change his mind tomorrow about what he wishes to do with it tomorrow.
And that's not even touching on the argument about whether what he is using his wealth on is the best use of that wealth.
1. All employees are opted into the plan at hire at 10% of salary, possibly even with a default 1% contribution increase per year (I'm unsure).
2. It's actually not exactly 50% match; it's 100% match on the first $3k and then no additional match on the next $3k, or in other words, it's 100% match that smoothly decreases down to 50% match by $6k and then stays at 50% all the way up to the IRS limit. This helps reduce the 401k "Gini coefficient"; it's progressive contributions.
3. A lot of the lowest rungs of jobs are TVCs, not employees, so they don't even count for this test because they're technically employees of another company (which itself would have a much worse 401k plan than Google's, if any). It's not great but it's relevant here :/
Edit: I don’t know what warrants this a downvote; you’re insulated if you think no-limit matches are common.
Rolex does a 300% matching, doesn't mean that all Swiss companies do the same.
Maybe they believe in the mission? Is anyone forcing them to work at Tesla? As far as I know Tesla doesn't use slave labour (not sure about China).
he's not humble in anyway, looking at his twitter he comes off as a real twat to boot as well.
Oh America, how you have fallen.
That said, most of these billionaires have gotten there because they were able to abuse some part of the capitalistic society. The "quality product for a fair price" bit is warped in some way due to monopoly power, exploiting their workers, etc.
Which is why a lot of people really dislike the Waltons, Bezos, etc billionaires. Its hard to answer why they should benefit so hugely when they could have cut into their wealth a little and given their employees a working wage, or slightly better benfits, etc. Instead they have created massive generational wealth gaps where their children/etc will effectively be royalty, and then cynically used propaganda to even neuter the government/financial system from ever re-leveling the playing field.
And what for, so they can have tens of billions instead of tens of millions while something like 50% of the population lacks even basic healthcare, or for that matter food security?