Comment by HenryBemis | Hacker News Reader

Comment by HenryBemis | Hacker News Reader

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Dave Ramsey (not connected in any way - just like his message), can be a bit 'over the top' sometimes, but in his daily radio show you can listen some (financial mismanagement) horror stories. He has a "7 baby steps process" that I believe everyone should know (and adapt to his/her will/preferences/life setup). Yes is a fanatic christian, yes, he can be a bit tiring when he takes a religious tangent, but still, I find his message very useful. I would really liked to have discovered him 20-30 years ago (or whoever was the Dave Ramsey at that time).

I really appreciated/found really helpful the tip of the "seven bank accounts" (Jordan Page, FunCheapOrFree)(also not connected in any way): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auzLhKvsxnQ

(Ramsey a similar type of management the "envelope system").

Edit: from what he sometimes says on his radio show, some schools in the USA 'teach' his program/system/7-step-process. I find this amazing and I wish that this (or something similar) is properly taught to every school on the planet.

Sorry you're getting downvoted. He is a bit hyperbolic, but his steps are extremely easy to understand and can help curb bad habits that a lot of Americans have. He is also a likeable person I think and that means more people will listen to him than better (perhaps) advice coming from college professors who wrote a book on the same subject but who are less charismatic. A lot of HN people will downvote you for being a "shill" or "I know someone better" but you are on point and don't let the downvotes be taken personally. It's a failure on the downvoter rather than you when you are on topic and relating pertinent information.

There's a really complex/perverse thing here which I'm going to fumble with, so I hope the dear reader forgives.

This information is not available to the black community. Now, obviously, any black person is technically capable of tuning into the Fox News channel where Dave Ramsey has a show, or dial their radio to conservative radio stations where Dave Ramsey is broadcast. But in practical terms, Dave Ramsey is unavailable to black people. And they are actively discouraged by our culture from even finding out that he exists.

I became aware of this in a discussion with a black friend i which she believed something that was "sort of" untrue. It was something approximately like she believed that white people grow up in homes where certain concepts like basic personal finance are taught. This was so bizarre sounding to me, because my actual life experience was so different. I grew up in a poor "white trash" household. My parents were/are buried in debt up to their necks. Basic personal finance, the Ramsey flavor or otherwise, was simply not in the ether. I didn't grow up with Fox on the TV either, or anything even pretending to be news. I still don't generally watch Fox News, but am a Ramsey fan.

I believe my friend was technically wrong, but maybe directionally right. She was directionally right in the sense that even though Dave Ramsey wasn't in my household, it was culturally at least acceptable. If you're far enough left wing to where you can't bring yourself to listen to Fox News/conservative radio, you can maybe get by with Clark Howard combined with Planet Money. Still extremely white in culture and audience.

I hope we figure out some way to get past this. Because even the pitiful tools that are available aren't available to everyone.

I appreciate you for being open, vulnerable and expressing your ideas. However I am black and what you are saying does not sound correct to me. I know a lot of black people (including my family) who listen to Dave Ramsey and watch Fox News. Black people are in general pretty religiously conservative in the US. Personally I used to watch financial TV channels growing up like CNBC and listen to Clark Howard and Susie Orman.

I can see the appeal of a straight talker and pull up by your boot straps personality such as Ramsey. He has helped a lot of people. His style does not work for me personally.

I personally think the financial problems (in general) with black people (aside from racism) in the US stems from two related things: the lack of a coherent family structure and lack of intergenerational wealth transfer. The single-mother family poverty angle is pretty clear: Single mothers have low availability and are poor, and poor people tend to make poor financial decisions due to exploitation and desperation. The intergenerational wealth transfer angle is if you have something of value you are going to transfer to the next generation, you are going to spend time teaching them how to care for it. Think transferring a business, property, and other assets. Legacy is a real important thing for most people. This is something rare for black Americans. Unfortunately in a lot of cases the thing that is transferred between generations are debt obligations.

Fox News black viewership population through 2018 was fully 1% https://www.newsweek.com/fox-news-white-audience-immigration...

I’m not discounting your life experience but statistically speaking most black households do not experience Fox News. And if you lived in an environment where most black households did experience Fox News, then that might point to an even more skewed environment, statistically speaking.

That's my big problem with Dave Ramsey. He's a rent-seekers financial advisor. There are lots of people who should cut their losses and let a bill get written off, but he brings his "ethical" view and counsels them to spend afew years feeding their kids garbage so the company can get paid.

> I personally think the financial problems (in general) with black people (aside from racism) in the US stems from two related things: the lack of a coherent family structure and lack of intergenerational wealth transfer.

You say “aside from racism” and then point to two things directly attributable to racist policies.

Agreed.

Dave Ramsey isn't the only personal finance pundit out there. Nor even close to being among the best ones. Dave is downright mediocre.

You're also denying people of color agency by saying that unless personal finance education comes to them, they have no hope of finding it by themselves.

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