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Comment by aden1ne | Hacker News Reader

> Most landlords don't even allow their rent to be paid online.

This just completely flummoxes me. The US really is a third world nation sometimes.

Here in the Netherlands it is unthinkable to pay your rent in cash. Most people pay their rent via standing order, or for the few people who haven't automated their payments, via direct wire transfer.

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Please don't take HN threads into nationalistic flamewar.

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It completely flummoxes me what Europeans are willing to believe based on unsourced off hand HN comments.

I assume they mean cash, in the sense of typically a bank withdrawal via check. In which case, they can almost certainly also set up a recurring check payment via their bank online. I actually send quite a few "checks" but with the exception of my housekeeper and some service people I rarely actually write out a check.

I haven't written a cheque in over twenty years, they don't exist any more in Norway.

I find it more convenient to use checks for some purchases but the thing that makes them bad for small businesses is banks charging insufficient fund fees to both the depositor and the person who wrote the check.

We bought some salsa from a local business yesterday and she takes Venmo, Zelle, or cash (not the app). If she took a check and it bounced (insufficient funds), then she would be out the money and probably a $12 fee besides.

https://www.bankofamerica.com/smallbusiness/resources/fees-a... It's interesting to see how business checking accounts have changed - there's no free level. You're charged a fee for every deposit past a certain number. I wonder how many small businesses are run now without a business checking account. But a credit union like Unitus https://www.unitusccu.com/business-checking/has free business checking accounts. Deposits are charged $.15 after the first 75 but if you sweep your electronic accounts (Cash app, Venmo, PayPal, etc.) in every other day you could take 5 of them.

I only converted about 2 years ago to taking pictures of checks and depositing them. It's much easier than going to the bank or mailing the deposits to Charles Schwab. Three of us did a joint purchase and I got a check from one. The other sent me payment via PayPal but PayPal took 3% as a fee. It didn't bother me enough to say something but it definitely didn't make me happy. It'd be nice to have an option that was zero-cost or $.10 fee per transaction. I bank with credit unions that don't have Zelle yet.

> The other sent me payment via PayPal but PayPal took 3% as a fee.

Presumably this was funded by a credit card. I believe it's free if it's from PayPal balance or a checking account.

I never used/saw them when I was in the US - I always paid via bank. I’m sure it’s an option though.

For what my anecdote is worth, I’ve rented a half-dozen apartments, and I’ve never paid cash for rent, nor had a landlord suggest cash payment.

And I don’t know anyone else who has either.

If I were to rent another apartment, I would expect to pay by check.

You can replace "cash" with "check" in the parent comment, it still applies :) ("third world nation" would probably be a bit strong)

> "third world nation" would probably be a bit strong

Or a bit weak. Not sure any nation has phased out cash entirely, but I'd assume many developing economies have phased out general use of checks if they ever had it.

("third-world" is very much a misnomer as it meant countries not aligned with either the US — the first world — or the USSR — the second world — so the US can't be a third-world nation by definition)

It's probably safe to say that the term has evolved into referring to less-developed nations rather than the original meaning, at least when used inside the US.

What's wrong with checks/cheques? I prefer paying by check and I'd be pretty miffed if ever I had a landlord that didn't accept them. I don't understand why Europeans think the option of paying by check is so derisible. I could just as easily have the money sent automatically by my credit union every month, but I want to pay by check.

> but I want to pay by check

Totally your right ofc, but I'm curious about why? What makes paying by check better for you compared to an automatic or manual transfer?

Checks are the #1 lowest friction way to pay. You don’t need internet connectivity, don’t need to make change, don’t need their bank account number — you don’t even need the recipient to have a bank account at all.

They suck to receive, but I love paying with them.

I don’t even have to write them out if I don’t want to, I can schedule them to be sent by my bank automatically.

Because of the frequent fraud and anti-fraud problems checks have. As far as I know, most people in the USA need that money that day or that week. Any delay is risky. ID-fraud or a flagged check seems like a nerve wracking incident.

As far as I'm concerned checks are simple and low stress. If you don't prefer them that's as valid an opinion as mine, but why is the option of paying by check seen as so awful?

For instance, elsewhere in this discussion (emphasis my own): "no landlords I talked to took cheques, thankfully."

What's so great at other people being denied their preference??

And a ton of US banks already have a way around this I believe. You can setup bill pay and the bank will basically dropship your landlord a rent check.

This is done in America mostly for tax evasion purposes. Most larger buildings run by a real entity allow for bill pay, it's mom & pop landlords that usually ask for cash.

It's also done to avoid payment processing charges.

What payment processing charges? My bank doesn't charge me anything to pay a bill. Do you mean that the landlord has to pay to receive the money?

Only if you pay by credit card but I dont know if they allow that

Depends on how they recieve it.

What seems to often happen in cases like my town is that they've farmed out online payment to some third party processor. I'm guessing they do this for free or a reduced charge in exchange for a fairly hefty processing fee. As a result, it's cheaper for me to pay town bills via check even if they're usually online check via my bank.

Never seen a charge for a wire transfer in europe.

Take that with a grain of salt. I've been renting in the US since I got into college, 5 apartment complexes later and I have yet to see a single place that will not let you pay online. This might be the case for some smaller apartments, but anything bigger and they will always have online payments.

I think OP might be a renter in NYC / SF where you have smaller landlords that aren't running 300+ unit complexes.

The ones that ask for cash are probably trying to avoid some taxes... I didn't pay cash for my rent in the USA.

I pay my rent by "check" but it's still fully automated. You just log into your bank and set up a recurring payment; they print a check and mail it every month (for free).

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