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Comment by Pfhreak | Hacker News Reader

I rarely purchase meat, maybe once every two years, but when I do I buy directly from a local farmer whose farm I can visit. I've bought whole beef this way, and the quality to price ratio was amazing. Grass fed, organically raised, humanely treated beef for ~$5.50/lb.

Granted, I had to buy hundreds of pounds of it, but I got all sorts of cuts, bones for broth, organs (tongue, heart, liver, etc.)

The process was surprisingly simple, and I wish more people knew it was an option. I'd be happy to outline what was involved for anyone curious.

I don't object to killing animals, but the way we raise them industrially is truly one of the horrors of our time.

After committing to only eating animals I could trace the provenance of, I rarely eat meat these days, perhaps once or twice a month I'll pull something from the freezer. The variety of vegetarian and vegan options has really exploded.

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I don’t know much about “tracing the provenance” of this or that... but, you should know that what you’re describing is pretty common for those of us in flyover country. Every semester or so, my roommates and I would go pick a cow out (we had ranches), have it processed, and fill up a deep freezer we had in our rented house. Pounds and pounds of steaks and more hamburger than you could ever eat. Also had an endless supply of venison.

I now live close to the border and frequently head across for large carneasadas with the in-laws and extended families. We usually buy some goats... the kids play with them for a while, then we butcher them on the spot and eat them up. Sometimes, we’ll have a cow (usually hiring a few locals to butcher it... unlike a goat, a cow is a lot of work without the proper equipment.)

Consequently, I don’t find the whole thing all that exotic or romantic. It’s just meat. Whether it’s butchered by me or in a factory, makes little difference to me.

I’m not criticizing you... just couldn’t help but butting in to remind the urbanites that what you are describing seems sort of amusing... as I type this, there is an annoying chicken in our backyard that — for whatever strange reason — clucks late into the night... she will be in my stomach this Sunday.

It's super rare out here in the coast. Though many people do raise chickens, bees, or the occasional goat in their yards.

oh man that last part makes me sad, i have to confess

We don’t want nocturnal chickens keeping us all up. I’m doing my part to guide chicken evolution away from such an outcome.

How can one know it's not saying something meaningful, I find myself thinking, also surrounded by nature

The way you procure meat is definitely the best way possible from an ethical point of view, and I wish it would be more widespread. Unfortunately, it is only accessible for the most privileged - for those who can upfront hundreds of dollars for the animal, have ample space for a freezer and can afford the electricity keeping it up.

We need to create a system that keeps up high animal care standards on one side - and has widespread accessibility across all classes of society. The alternative is that either we continue with meat grown in abhorrent conditions with all risks (bacterial contamination of meat, pathogens jumping species) and externalities (manure nitrogen runoffs, methane emissions, smell) associated or that only the elites will be able to have meat - something that far-right populists are already accusing left parties (such as the Greens in Germany) of already doing.

(Yes, lab grown meat is a thing, but it will probably be another two or three decades until I can eat a lab grown steak!)

See my comment above but in short in the UK I believe the systems and controls that you describe already exist https://www.waitrose.com/home/inspiration/about_waitrose/abo...

$1000 for meat for a year doesn't require "the most privilege". It's certainly not what is stopping millions of people in the US.

It does take time, a large freezer, and money on hand. Not everyone has cash like that sitting around.

Two thirds of all Americans don't have 1000$ in savings (https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/86455/over-two-thirds-am...), and of those that do have that amount available, most are in no way able to put down $1000 in one piece for meat.

It always comes down to the "Boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness" in the end. Most of the stuff we are talking about here is nowhere near practically applicable for the majority of the population.

I have plenty of savings, but about $300 in my savings account, the rest spread across checking and other accounts. I'd be counted amongst the "poor" in this poll due to that. Is there more data somewhere? The poll is often touted, but I wonder if it shows what you think, or just shows that savings accounts now days are mostly useless?

These polls are based on net assets, at least the German ones which show similarly disastrous results.

For what it's worth 40 million people i the US are facing eviction because they can't come up with something as essential as rent. This is how deep the social divide has become in the US.

Got links for US ones based on net assets? Would definitely clear up the situation one way or the other.

Yeah. I did find that with lots of friends it's possible to split an animal. I generally keep half of the beef and coordinate friends to split the other half. It definitely takes some time, which is a privilege in itself, but it's definitely possible to get a group of families together to group buy.

Are there no programs like this already? In the UK we have systems like https://www.waitrose.com/home/inspiration/about_waitrose/abo...

Expensive though

I’d love to see an outline of this, I don’t know where to find these farmers. I briefly bought eggs from a local farmer but after moving have not been able to find a similar arrangement.

Is "local farmer" better than "pasture raised" at the grocery story?

For me, yes. The label pasture raised could still imply corn finished (and a feedlot or CAFO). Knowing the farmer, seeing the fields, and building a relationship with them holds emotional value to me.

It cuts out the middle man too -- my money is going to a local farmer and a local butcher, I can specify exactly which cuts I want, how I want them prepared, etc.

First is finding a local farmer and knowing their timeline for a harvest. In Western Washington, you can use http://www.tilthalliance.org/ to look up farmers by product (meat, veg, fruits, eggs, fish, etc.)

Reach out to farmers and see who actually has something available, ask any questions you have about how they raise the animal. Ask about their process for ordering and whether they'll transport to a butcher. Put a deposit down on an animal.

Once you've put your deposit down, you wait for your harvest date. In my case, they transported the animal to the butcher, where it hung for a couple weeks. During that time, you prepare a 'cut sheet'. This describes how you'd like the animal prepared -- steaks or roasts, ground meat or not, etc. The butcher can walk you through this and tell you what's common.

After a few weeks, the butcher will give you a call, your meat is ready! Drive there and load your car with hundreds of pounds of individually wrapped steaks, roasts, ground beef, stew meat, soup bones, etc. Drive home and load up your freezer, distribute to friends who went in on the purchase with you, etc.

Lastly, figure out lots of recipes. Learn to braise, sous vide, grill, make smashburgers, whatever. You are going to be eating a lot of beef, explore world cultures. There are so many different ways to prepare it, French is so different than German, Japanese is different than Korean, American is different than Mexican, etc. You have hundreds of pounds of beef to eat, variety is important.

Go for a drive in the country and look out for farms with "beef/bison for sale" signs up. If you don't see any, go into town and look for a butcher shop (or search for them online) and ask if they have farmers they work with to process steers.

That's as close to a process as I can think of for someone who doesn't "know the right people."

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