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Comment by webkike | Hacker News Reader

Not really, cities offer public transportation and a lot of enjoyable things to do. They were a thing before large corporations were seated there.

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This is why I'm in a suburb working from home. I do not want to ever not be near a city with things to do. I grew up in a very rural area and I hated it. There is a nostalgia uptick every now for the simple life now and then and I remember how terrible it was to be around uneducated rednecks and push it from my mind.

Uneducated rednecks are a bit better than educated rednecks. At least they have an excuse.

I love educated rednecks.

Maybe I misunderstand what redneck means in this context?

There is only one meaning of the term, at least nowadays. I think parent was sarcastic because part of definition of "redneck" is "uneducated", at least per OED.

Redneck means working class. Hence the red neck; the neck is sunburned from working outside

It's a good theory, etymologically. But do check your favorite dictionary about the actual definition of the word.

completely agree

cost of living in cities has been rising at an insane rate over the last decade, a large part of it is tech salaries. I know a ton of software engineers who only live in cities b/c that's where the jobs are. Places outside of cities also offer a lot of (different) enjoyable things to do.

Presumably big companies moving jobs away from cities will have some impact.

San Francisco had just as many houses before tech moved in, the only thing tech did was make housing more expensive

Both "cities will thin out because of covid" and "cities will remain the same despite covid" are pretty reductionist of much larger and more complicated trends I'm sure.

I'm aware I reduced the two sides in summarizing them above haha.

>San Francisco had just as many houses before tech moved in

That's the problem, no?

This. Basic supply/demand problem. For those in control of that scare resource (Bay Area housing close to employers/amenities), that constraint is pure profit.

Basically yes and insane NIMBY regulations have kept the city from reducing the cost of living via more open housing regulations and support for multiunit housing and ridiculous amounts of permitting.

A large part is an imbalance of housing production vs job creation.

Wouldn't that mean living in cities will get cheaper? People that didn't want to live in the city but had to for work will move out, and people that wanted to live in the city but couldn't because it was too expensive will move in. Hopefully a cheaper equilibrium in cities will happen because of all this.

Exactly. Companies came to cities because thats where talent wanted to live. Not the other way around.

most people move to cities for work, not for restaurants and things to do. Not all, but most.

That's the reason they move there but may not be the reason they stay there. Once you change something in your life that allows you to take advantage of new opportunities, the latter may become the reason to support the change more than whatever initial reason you had.

Okay, but then what would be the incentive for the people who are already there to leave?

Life reasons I suppose

Depends on the city. Portland is a good example of a city with an anemic economy that people seem to be drawn to.

I mean, even Philly (where I live) has seen somewhat of a resurgence (especially relative to the MSA at large), despite a lot of jobs being outside the city.

I think we'll see the hypergrowth of the tech hubs drop off. I think cities more broadly might slow growth as millennials age into parenthood and that might be accelerated by recent events making cities more broadly seem less welcoming.

But I'm not sure that jobs will be the main driver here.

This isn't true at all. These tech companies opened offices in cities because thats where young talent wanted to/was living.

I've seen people in the Seattle area and SF area who want to live in cities so badly that they reverse commute out of the city to their offices (Seattle to Redmond for MS, SF to Menlo Park or Mountain View for FB and Goog). These companies have a large group of private buses that handle this commute so it's common enough in those groups that there is evidence people move to the cities for things besides work.

> a lot of enjoyable things to do

That's the thing though. For the next $few years, they offer nothing but a higher chance of infection. All enjoyable things are closed

Unless you live in the US (which I do, for the record), COVID is not going to be ravaging the countryside for years to come.

It seems implausible that most entertainment will be closed for years to come.

I live in Toronto and we are already in stage 3 of reopening. Restaurants have allowed indoor dining and gyms have started to reopen. Movie theatres are also open.

Streets are bustling and patios are pretty full again.

I think this whole thing is overblown and we will return to normal sooner than people think.

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